About 2 weeks ago, I was reading through Benjamen’s post on how he’s been using a Milwaukee M18 right angle impact driver.
I was up to the links section, and considered whether to keep his link to Amazon or not. Milwaukee tools are sold on Amazon, but often through 3rd party sellers, some of them authorized dealers, and by resellers. But, since the kit was lower priced on Amazon than elsewhere, I left it in.
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From there, I saw something odd – a related tool with Prime shipping. Well, that’s possible when a 3rd party seller ships inventory to an Amazon warehouse for Amazon fulfillment.
Another click or two later and I came across something really strange – Milwaukee tools being sold directly by Amazon.
Milwaukee Tools Sold by Amazon
I asked Milwaukee if Amazon was once again an authorized dealer, and they said NO, Amazon is not an authorized dealer for Milwaukee.
They’re aware of 3rd party listings, but what I’ve been seeing are Ships from and sold by Amazon listings. One item I saw, a newish M18 jobsite radio, was listed as being priced “exclusively for Prime members.”
In the past week or so, a lot of the listings have been selling out, or they might have been removed.
Some of the listings are of newer tools, so it’s not as if it’s “new old stock” from back when Amazon was a Milwaukee dealer.
If Milwaukee is not selling these tools to Amazon, where are they getting them from?
In most cases, Amazon is selling the tools and accessories at the same price as authorized dealers. So maybe they’re trying to make the case that they can adhere to MAP or MSRP pricing? Several tool brands don’t do business with Amazon anymore due to pricing disagreements.
I don’t know what to make of this. Is any of this important? I’ve also asked Milwaukee about how this might affect warranty coverage of the tools, if at all. I think that would be my biggest concern.
So where do you think Amazon is buying these Milwaukee tools from?
Mr. Creek says
Free market, got to love it.
Matt says
You are an idiot. Seriously. And clearly you have no idea about Amazon.
The main reason that Brands are removing their products from Amazon is counterfeiting. Amazon will list Apple as the seller even when it is a random counterfeiter from China. They won’t police it and they won’t remove it.
If by free market you mean absolutely no rules, and that companies can mislead consumers by claiming other companies’ names, then you will enjoy the ride down.
Seriously, you are a tragically uninformed idiot. Which I suppose is redundant.
What I really love is that you are likely one of the people on this site that bemoans that craftsman tools are crap now and no tools are made in the US, but can’t make the simple connections why.
Szymon says
Why did Amazon stop being an authorized dealer?
Stuart says
I don’t know. It might have been part of their tight partnership with Home Depot.
I don’t remember when it happened, but it must have been after August 2011.
Looking back at ToolGuyd’s archives, there were a few Milwaukee deals on Amazon, including a “deal of the day” on an M12 combo kit. So it was sometime around or after late 2011 that the falling out happened.
It was done quietly too. All of a sudden, I just happened to notice that Amazon stopped selling Milwaukee tools, and I hadn’t seen them sold directly by Amazon since then, until recently.
Hang Fire says
About the same time that Milwaukee tools disappeared from Lowe’s.
Luke says
Let us know what you discover regarding warranty coverage. I switched to the M18 line over the summer and have already bought a number of bare tools through prime.
What I don’t understand is how they’re saying “NO, Amazon is not an authorized dealer for Milwaukee,” while the seller/fulfiller is listed as Milwaukee.
Stuart says
Milwaukee Tool is not selling these tools to Amazon, and so they’re not recognized as an authorized dealer.
So if there’s a promo or something, such as the recent Hole Dozer and Sawzall blade promo, you won’t be eligible if you order them from Amazon directly. Maybe not even if you order from an authorized 3rd party on Amazon.
http://toolguyd.com/milwaukee-hole-dozer-hole-saws-sawzall-reciprocating-saw-blades-free-bonus-deal-122016/
Dave says
They are getting them from Milwaukee or really TTI whole controls their logistics and supply chain. I used to work for Swatch Group and this is common practice in the watch industry to sell to non authorized dealers. They can’t have Amazon be an authorized dealer because they can’t control Amazon’s prices, and it would also undermine and alienate thier dealer network, but at the same time they can’t afford to not have their tools not be sold through the largest and most convenient tool seller on the planet.
Jon says
That sounds about right to me, and I also don’t think the statement that “several tools brands don’t do business with amazon” is fair as you can purchase all the major brand tools from amazon. They all do business with amazon like it or not.
Stuart says
PB Swiss and Beta won’t do business with Amazon anynore.
Count on Tools, a PB Swiss distributor, has been selling some items on Amazon via Amazon Fulfillment.
Beta tools won’t sell to Amazon anymore either, but their USA distributor started selling some things on Amazon, but the prices and shipping fees aren’t very appealing.
These brands, and Milwaukee, and probably others, won’t sell to Amazon for direct sales on Amazon.
Amazon doesn’t or cannot control 3rd party listings.
Milwaukee, PB Swiss, Beta, and other brands that don’t sell to Amazon still aren’t doing business with Amazon, even if some sellers are selling their tools on Amazon.
Let’s say someone references your comment here. They can say that they saw it on ToolGuyd, but not by ToolGuyd. It’s a subtle but important distinction.
Jon says
It’s not a matter of controlling third party sellers. A third party can’t sell under Amazon prime and I can order lots of Milwaukee products from prime (which is direct sales). So they are doing business directly with Amazon.
Stuart says
Yes, they can, it’s called “fulfilled by Amazon.”
I can go to Home Depot, buy up a bunch of Milwaukee tools, ship them to Amazon, and sell them under Amazon Fulfillment. Anyone could.
Just because an item is Prime eligible does not mean you’re buying it directly from Amazon.
But that’s not the point of this post.
There are some Milwaukee tools being sold directly by Amazon. But they didn’t get them from Milwaukee Tool, so where did they come from?
Jon says
I can’t reply below, but Stuart the Milwaukee listings don’t say “fulfilled by Amazon”.
Stuart says
Right. That’s the whole point of this post.
There are a lot of Milwaukee listings on Amazon, sold directly by Amazon. Milwaukee Tool does not have a supplier-retailer relationship with Amazon. So what’s going on?
Separately, look at this PB Swiss Insider Stubby listing:
https://www.amazon.com/PB-Swiss-PB-8453-Insider-Stubby/dp/B01AW8RSLI/
It’s eligible for Prime, because:
Sold by Count On Tools – PB Swiss Tools Distributor and Fulfilled by Amazon.
PB Swiss Tools will not sell to Amazon directly, as of a few years ago.
firefly says
That make sense. I also think that they have an unofficial policy at Milwaukee that if someone purchase a tool from Amazon directly then treat the warranty just as it was from an authorized dealer. After all, it’s very unlikely for Amazon to sell knock off item or pass on used/open box item as new. So I doubt Milwaukee would want to burn that bridge as long as Amazon doesn’t engage in deceptive business practice like some third party seller might.
Stuart says
If they honor the warranty, I’d think it’s out of desire to maintain and grow a positive relationship with the user, and not necessarily keep the bridge open with Amazon.
firefly says
That’s what I mean, I doubt they want to penalize users for getting their tool from a non-authorized dealer but popular and reputable source.
I can see three reasons why it matter for a manufacture to have authorized sources. First, pricing control, a race to bottom doesn’t help anyone. Secondly, to ensure that the dealer doesn’t engage in deceptive business practice such as passing a knock off as the real thing. Third, is to establish a channel for training/marking and promotion.
So I can see why it make sense not to warranty tool from a non-authorize dealer. The problem is that unless they are as big as Amazon. How can the manufacture go after them if they are selling knock off for example? Amazon is a big and reputable company. They have a reputation to maintain and pocket book to back it up. I am not suggesting that all third party dealer are bad. All I am suggesting is that if something is wrong, it’s a lot harder and not worthwhile to go after a no-name seller on Amazon.
fred says
I too can’t figure Amazon out sometimes.
Maybe they (Amazon) have a surreptitious deal with some authorized dealer(s) to help the dealer(s) get their volume up and/or clear inventory that is moving sluggishly.
The only Milwaukee tool I bought through Amazon in 2016 was a M18 bare tool for which I paid just under 20% less than I could buy it at Home Depot (after tax) – but just as important to me it’s delivery date was better – as it was OOS at nearby Home Depots at the time . It was sold by a third party – arrived looking brand new but just in a plastic bag with its manual and one blade. My take was that it had been stripped out of a kit to be sold separately.
Derek Hartman says
I just returned my M12 Fuel impact, twice, to Milwaukee for warranty repairs. Attached Amazon order invoice as proof of purchase. They completed the warranty repair no questions asked.
Adam says
If it is a legitimate Milwaukee tool, you shouldn’t need the receipt, unless you happen to get a tool that had been sitting in the shelf for a long time (where if the tool breaks in year 4 of ownership, but mnf. 5 years ago, then you would want it). They go by the serial # on the tool, which starts off with the year made. You can buy tools off Craigslist and not worry about it.
John says
This doesn’t help the already shaky confidence in Amazon’s recent (last couple of years) fake and scamming 3rd party sellers. If its listed as “from Amazon” or even worse directly direct from the manufacturer as the seller there should be absolutely no question about its origin otherwise this is fraud and a bait and switch straight up. I understand they further blur this line when Amazon themselves can’t fill an order, they go to stock from another vendor on their behalf but this is getting them in muddy waters. I’d rather they said I have to wait or that its not in stock in that case and wait for the real certified and backed up sale and by that I mean putting their neck out on the line as an authorized vendor.
I really wish Amazon had a profile option to cut out and opt out of all 3rd party vendor listings all together and only have authorized direct from vendor and Amazon themselves. After having been burned several times, I’m really not a happy customer anymore.
Parke says
I completely agree. I always filter to show only Amazon as the seller but many people don’t and I think it hurts Amazon’s reputation. Many times I’ll be at a family gathering and mention a great deal I found and an older relative will say “well I tried to buy my favorite shoes and they were $1000” or something like that clearly sold by a 3rd party. Recently so many of these off brand products that are fulfilled by Amazon are showing up at the top of a search listing because of the numerous 5 star “reviews” and it makes the shopping experience feel more like eBay.
Stuart says
I try to filter Amazon as the seller for some things, but the sidebar doesn’t always offer that option.
With ToolGuyd links, I sometimes modify the URL so as to show things more clearly.
For example:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0001NQQCM/?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=toolguyd-20
B0001NQQCM is the product’s unique identifier
smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER forces focus on Amazon as the seller, even if the item is out of stock
tag=toolguyd-20 is ToolGuyd’s “tag” for getting affiliate revenue from sales through a clicked link
I’m not going to type out smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER every time I need to sort something, and don’t expect anyone else to. But I figured it’s a good FIY.
Amazon links are full of random tracking info. Individual pages can be simplified down to https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0001NQQCM/ , or sometimes there’s harmless SEO keywords in there too. This links to the same product:
https://www.amazon.com/Wera-Kraftform-Screwdriver-Lasertip-6-Pieces/dp/B0001NQQCM/
Notice that a higher priced 3rd party listing is in the front focus, with Amazon’s price and “add to cart” button in the right side bar.
https://www.amazon.com/Wera-Kraftform-Screwdriver-Lasertip-6-Pieces/dp/B0001NQQCM/?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER
Adding the smid switches things so the lower Amazon price is front and center. It’s automatically removed from front and center because it’s temporarily out of stock at Amazon, and so that’s what their store algorithm does.
Parke says
Wow I had no idea all of that was built in. Forcing Amazon to be displayed as the main seller would be really helpful if I’m trying to share a link with someone who could easily get confused. It could also avoid having to choose a department before the filter toolbar let’s you select a seller. It seems like products aren’t always in the category you would think like some tools being located in the industrial and scientific department. Some of the FBA sellers must use bots to set their price a penny below Amazon and bump them out of the first displayed option.
Jon says
For me I filter results by “prime” which is always an available option and always eliminates third party sellers. I have never seen an item for sale by a third party for less than the prime price, even items that offer free shipping.
Also I don’t think sellers can just decide to ship items to Amazon warehouses and now they are “prime” listings, I think Amazon decides what to stock their shelves with based on demand!
firefly says
Prime shipping only mean it’s fulfilled by amazon. Though it’s true that if it’s sold by Amazon, it’s definitely shipped by Amazon.
Mark says
I placed one order with Amazon directly only once ever. There will NEVER be a 2nd time. They did not ship the two items, for 2weeks, and when I tried to cancel the order for a refund the help pages only took me in an endless loop back to the order page. So I called and demanded a refund, but still the clerk insisted I wait for the order to be shipped. I held my ground and got the refund. I then immediately ordered the exact same two items on eBay, for $4 more and they arrived in two days, inside an Amazon marked box ! Two weeks later, 4-weeks after ordering from Amazon, a package arrived from them and I told the postman to take it back, I would not accept it. Never ever again. So mad about them not letting me get a refund easily when the item clearly showed it had not even shipped yet for 2-weeks.
Jim Felt says
For both myself and for business uses I basically order on Amazon daily.
I have never experienced any issues as you’ve described. And I’ve been a Prime Member since its inception.
And when I occasionally have a issue I call them (never email or chat) and without fail get a simple and immediate resolution.
Additionally I’ve noticed on returns my credit card is credited within a day or 3. But always acknowledged within an hour of my dropping it off at UPS.
And no sadly for me I do not own stock. Sniff. Snuffle.
Chris says
I also order from Amazon almost daily, and have never experienced anything like what Mark describes (and I’ve done close to a dozen returns over the years).
Parke says
That sounds like a third party order. Any shipping issues I have had were quickly and fairly resolved by customer service. If Amazon ships a package and it missed the deadline they gave you and you ask about it, they will usually ask you to wait another 2 or 3 days and if it still hasn’t arrived they overnight ship a replacement. If it has not even shipped yet, you can usually cancel the order in your own without getting CS involved.
fred says
I am a “frequent flyer” so to speak on Amazon. Checked and see that I placed over 400 orders with them this year – shipped to multiple addresses in different states. I’d say that over 90% of the orders have been without any hiccups. A few have missed their expected delivery dates on Prime shipments – and when I complained on the phone to a CS rep I had my Prime membership extended by a month each time. I do think that this has happened at least 6 times in 2016 – and I don’t recall that it happened as frequently in the past. But to be fair I’ve been more aware and checking up lately. Shipments from third party sellers have been a bit more hit and miss – coming sometimes from China, Japan, the UK etc. It may also be anecdotal information – but I think that as Amazon has grown – the number of phony vendors (scammers) that try to take advantage of us via Amazon – may also be up a bit. In balance, I’m still happy doing business with them.
firefly says
I echo what Chris and Jim said. I also have been a long time Prime member and I have placed a lot of orders with them over the year, both personal and business. I am not sure if that have anything to do with the level of customer service that I received.
Overall the customer service that I have experience have always been good. If it wasn’t I would definitely walk since Amazon pricing is no longer attractive as they have been. This is not to mention the Prime membership fee has also increased. Prime two day shopping has also been a hit or miss. Some of the two day shipping will now have an estimate of three or four days. In short the Amazon shipping game, even with Prime, has been questionable as of late.
Bruce says
Only partially related to this post. A year ago I purchased a Pioneer car stereo through amazon. About 9 months in the stereo died. Pioneer wouldn’t stand behind it. Further inspection showed it was a third party seller that wasn’t an authorized dealer. The dealer made it right, cross shipping me a replacement. These big companies are really trying to have it both ways. They make the same profit as they would if they only sold through authorized dealers but don’t have to honor the warranty. I wasn’t even shopping the lowest price, just the most convenient shipping. It’ll be the last Pioneer product I ever buy.
John says
I never understood that stance either. If it’s a legit product from them and they should know by serial number, they shouldn’t care how I got it, they got their money somehow so it really makes no sense authorized vendor or no. In this day in age they should be able to tell the exact transaction history of it and realize by serial that it’s legit and they should cover the warranty.
firefly says
Manufactures have to draw a line somewhere. Authorized usually mean a good establish relationship where those guy get proper training. Agreed on certain pricing structure and not engage in deceptive business practice such as selling knockoff. I am not saying that this is the case for your particular dealer. But how can the manufacture know? It will get costly to start to investigate every single cases. It will also set precedent within the company. Hey we make exception for X… what about Y? So unless there is a very good reason to make that exception it’s easier and usually better just to say no.
If you have your own manufacturing company, would you want Amazon or Home Depot to be one of your authorize dealer or a no-name third party seller on Amazon? Any large manufacture also have a reputation to maintain. So they will look for a dealer with establish reputation or a deep pocket book or both. A deep pocket book mean that hey if you screw with us at least our lawyer have something to go after. So once the small third party seller have establish a reputation for themselves then they should be on their way to become an authorized dealer.
Stuart says
ThermoWorks used to sell their Thermapen on Amazon. I was looking to see what the current price was one day, and discovered all their listings were gone.
Now, they only sell directly on their website, not on Amazon anymore.
There’s a big warning at the top of their page, talking about counterfeit, copycat, and open box units.
I guess that other sellers’ items and ThermoWorks’ were getting commingled, and it gave them enough headaches to stop selling on Amazon entirely.
Robbie Stanford says
This is common in the camera world, is Milwaukee tool (the actual manufacture) that same Milwaukee that is the distributor? For instance my camera is made by canon but I can’t buy it from canon, I have to buy it from canon USA who is the distributor, same goes for Coca Cola they make the drink but a separate company has distribution rights Coca Cola enterprises, separate companies.
Canon USA has exclusive rights to sell canon equipment in the United States, but canon (the manufacture) actually sells to some large stores like B&H the equipment is listed as grey market and does not carry a canon USA warranty, because it is not sold through them. But it is cheaper.
I bet the same thing is going on with Milwaukee, the parent company is selling to Amazon.
Jim Felt says
Grey market Canon and Nikons are only common when the dollar is out of parity with other Canon and Nikon countries authorized importers. And then some US dealers by on that secondary market. Neither Canon or Nikon sell around their own authorized Country wide distributors. But they turn a blind and warranty free eye on Guatemalan or Slovenian Distributors reselling to B&H and far lesser US resellers.
I’ve no idea if this applies to tool distribution. I kinda doubt it. The spread to too you. As are the end sales points. I’ve only bought grey market when I needed a lens now(!) for a job and none were available legitimately in the US dealer network.
But for a tool?
Caveat: I just ordered and received the Bosch 12volt little power saw from Amazon UK. In less then a week! And common Makita saw blades fit!
Jim Felt says
Damn iPhone in my coffee shop typos.
Sorry.
Skye says
Perhaps this article has something to do with it http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/safety-workwear/suit-against-home-depot-and-power-tool-companies-dismissed-for-now_o
Jon says
It’s not very likely that one of Milwaukee “authorized dealers” is secretly selling stock to Amazon, especially because the sheer volume of items sold on Amazon would outstrip any regular “authorized dealer” volume by several-fold.
Amazon is the biggest retailer in the world now and there’s no such thing as “not doing business with” the biggest retailer in the world when you are a company the size of TTI. It’s not even a decision the company executives can make, the shareholders and board of directors demand it!
Michaelhammer says
I think one would be crazy to buyMilwaukee from Amazon. I always, always, always find it cheaper somewhere else.