A few weeks ago I came across a forum thread where the poster was looking for durable rotary tool cut-off discs. He had bought some discs for his Dremel-style tool off of Ebay, and complained that they shattered way too easily.
Advertisement
I didn’t respond to the thread, but silently screamed MAYBE TRY SOME GENUINE DREMEL REINFORCED DISCS!!
Not that all name-brand power tool accessories are golden and all off brands’ accessories are junk, but there can be a huge difference in quality.
There are certain accessories where I am a stickler for brand names. It’s not about the names though, but about proven quality and reliability.
This reminds me of when I attended Milwaukee’s 2012 media event, the one where they introduced a new line of M12 Fuel brushless drills and drivers. As we took a brief tour around the headquarters, one of the rooms we passed by was a testing lab that was said to be equipped with an electron microscope.
Once home, I sent Milwaukee an email, asking what their engineers use their test lab SEM for.
In the test lab, we utilize the Scanning Electron Microscope (SEM) to help determine the root cause of a failure if there is one. This could be on an accessory, like a Sawzall® Recip Saw blade, a hand tool or a part within a tool. By determining this root cause we can modify the design to eliminate any weak points and ultimately provide the best product possible to the end user.
Advertisement
For example, when our concept team develops a new product and a part fails during the testing of the first prototype, the part is sent to the material lab for analysis. The root cause of the problem is determined as well as the location on the part where the failure began. The concept engineer then takes that information and modifies the part design to eliminate stress risers. This new design is then prototyped and retested.
That’s a pretty standard answer, but I wouldn’t have thought Milwaukee did their own metallurgical testing. Now, I suppose I would be surprised to find a major power tool accessory brand or manufacturer that didn’t do metallurgical testing or failure analysis on their accessories.
Do you think that no-name brands go to such lengths to ensure they are producing the best quality accessories that they can? Or do they primarily focus on target pricing and acceptable rejection rates?
This brings to mind an older post – This is Why Cheap Drill Bit Sets are so Cheap – which describes how some Asian OEMs will mix a few well-built commonly used bits with a lot of cheap junky bits in the sets they sell.
I have seen off-brand “titanium” drill bits with flaking-off gold-colored paint. Saw blades with dull and crooked teeth. Sandpaper with uneven grit size and tissue-soft backing paper. Budget screwdriver bits made from super-soft steel.
Still, there are some off-brand accessories that seem to be well-regarded. Take Unibit-style step bits for example. While I have not yet tried generic-branded step bits, I have heard enough praise from experienced users that I might be inclined to give them a try.
Over at Amazon, you can get a set of Neiko-branded step bits for the price of a single Irwin Unibit.
Generally, the only time I go for off-brand accessories is when I think I might need a particular tool for very few uses. The only time this happened in recent years was when I purchased a set of generic silver and deming drill bits. As part of the same order I also bought two brand-name bits. The price of one good quality bit approached that for a 5-piece set of no-name import bits, but there were noticeable performance differences.
Aside from the silver and deming bits, I typically gravitate to tried-and-true brand name accessories. As mentioned, it’s about quality and reliability. I trust Bosch for jigsaw blades and masonry drill bits. Milwaukee for reciprocating saw blades. Dremel, Foredom, and 3M for rotary tool accessories. Dewalt for everyday drill bits (Pilot Point) and larger cut-off wheels. Freud and Diablo for 10″ and larger circular saw blades. This list isn’t strict, but reflects my typical preferences off the top of my head.
Do you do the same? In your experience, are there certain power tool accessories where brand names matter more? Less?
RKA
More or less the same as you…anything that cuts or grinds, I will gravitate to the known quantity first. If I use it regularly, the upfront cost is justified in the long term. If it’s really expensive and not something I see myself using again, I’ll save the coin and walk down the aisle of my local HF store. But generally, the experience with the tool is sacrificed with a poor blade and is safety and the end product. So buying the inexpensive no-name cutting/grinding implements tends to be the exception for me.
fred
I know that some of my crew members had different opinions about tools that took in their personal experience. I think that some also thought about utility, brand awareness and image (theirs and the tool’s).I suspect that some of this thinking was more applied to powered tools rather than accessories.
For my own part, I’ve tried over the years to take a pragmatic approach to tool buying. I mentally ask myself a few questions like:
• Is this a one-time use tool – or one that I need to last?
• Am I buying it for personal or commercial use?
• Are there reviews or other’s experience that can help in my decision-making?
• What are the potential consequences of tool failure?
o Might I or an employee be injured?
o Will it stop progress on a critical job?
o Might it ruin the item it is being used to create?
o Can it be replaced quickly if it fails?
o Or will a need for replacement result in unacceptable delays?
• What is the price differential between the name brand and the “el-cheapo”
o How does this compare to the potential cost of a failure?
o How does the cost compare to the overall cost/value of the job?
• Is a new (or unknown to me) tooling brand worth a try?
The result has been that I’ve bought a rather mixed-bag of tools over the years – some working out well – and some not so well – but at least adding to the experiential base.
firefly
I follow the same philosophy as well.
I general I tend to gravitate more toward tried and true brand name for two more reasons: good engineer/QA and they also have a reputation to protect.
Even the simple thing required good engineer to design/manufacture and good QAs to catch their mistakes. If both of them failed for some reason, which are unlikely, they also have a reputation to protect which ensure a better customer service experience.
Blair
Fred, while I agree with what you have as a written list, I personally would not put it in the order you have (assuming there is an order, and not just off the the top of the head ). I tend to be the safety first, will it ruin the product, type, but I’m still active in the contractor business, (40 + years now, where does the time go?) I think the guys like you , and I learned all these things from experience, and now with the evolution of brands, at least in my case, have to adapt to the newer offerings, it makes the marketplace tough. As I said, my priorities would be in a different order, but I suspect you were going from memory, and I have nothing but respect for the the things you have listed.
Be well my friend
RX9
This is pretty much what I was thinking. I’ve had reasonable success with cheap HF-style bits and accessories over the years. What’s more, with a lot of brand name accessories, you see that they were also made in China, so why bother paying for the fancy name? Obviously, the most reliable indicator of quality is prior experience, which can often be gleaned by looking at online reviews (Amazon, online forums, etc.). Barring that, I look at the materials listed on the package to get an idea of what I am dealing with. If the accessory does not list the technical specifications (Rockwell Hardness, rated max RPM, etc.), or alloy (Inconel, CR-MO, CR-V, S2, 316 stainless, 7075 T6, etc.) or process used (type III anodizing, induction hardening, drop forging, Titanium Nitride coating, Zinc Coating, etc.), then it is probably made from inferior material and mostly useless.
There are a lot of instances where you get what you pay for, but a lot of instances where you don’t.
RX9
Perfect example of when HF is just a better deal is the licensed “Snap-On” stuff:
https://toolguyd.com/new-snap-on-tools-knives-storage-products/
I hate to see them Fiorina-ing (read up on the history of Hewlett Packard) the brand like that, but you’ve got to watch out.
skfarmer
i also try to avoid cheap accessories. i will take exception to your dewalt pilot point drill bits. i have the large set up to 1/2 inch by 64ths. i have broken more of them than any other bits i have ever used. i don’t know why i keep replacing them with the same bits, just ocd i guess. i suppose that when they work they work well but when they fail they do so in a dramatic way.
Robert
We put too much emphasis on our tools and not nearly enough on accessories. When you think about it, the accessory is often the actual tool. It’s where the rubber meets the road and does the actual work. The part that we call the tool, is really just a tool holder. It could be a screwdriver bit, sawblade, etc. Therefore, the part that we call the tool is only as good as the accessory we put in it. I admittedly love gadget multibit screwdrivers. I learned however that if you’re going to scrimp, put your money in the bits. A Wera bit in a cheap driver is better any day than an inferior bit in a $45.00 driver.
A good analogy is refillable ballpoint pens. The refill really is the pen. The part we call the pen is really just a pen holder. The “pen” is only as good as the refill. Over the years I’ve found pens I loved, and hated the refills. The same in reverse. Cross makes great pens. Their standard refills in my opinion however, are dime store quality. A basic Papermate refill is 10 times better than a Cross. The refill is where the rubber meets the road. I like Cross pens, but would pick a Papermate any day because of the cheap nature of Cross standard refills.
I always thought this was kind of a no-brainer. I’m amazed at the people who think they’re saving money by investing in cheaper accessories. They’re always more expensive in the long run.
firefly
Very true
Jkrl73
I deinitely agree.
I once tested a VERY cheap drill against a Bosch green line (Skil in the US) drill, drilling in a brick wall, 5 or 6 mm hole which is supposed to be not a big deal. The difference between a cheap drill bit and a good one (Alpen) was huge. The difference between the drill was little. I found the good drill with the cheap bit to drill worse that the el-cheapo drill with a good bit.
Good bits and blades save time and frustration – the job takes less time and effort, not to mention what happens if the bit breaks in the middle of the job.
RX9
This is absolutely true, but I would counter that folks worry about the mechanical part because it’s a more costly mistake. I learned the importance of the driving mechanism after having Kawasaki (Alltrade) drills (at $45-50 a pop) burn out on myself, then my brother, and then two of my friends.
When I needed an angle grinder, I didn’t hesitate to skip the $10 HF specials and went straight to a $140 Metabo model. I have not regretted that decision once. Ironically, I do use HF paint stripping discs with my grinder, as I’ve figured out that there isn’t any difference between those and the also made-in-China name brand’s products. Some accessories are overpriced, and some are well worth the money. You just have to experiment to see what works.
Mark
I usually buy name-brand, and I gravitate towards Bosch every time I can. Even with name brands sometimes you have bad experiences, but I’ve always had good luck with Bosch.
Robert
Mark,
I agree. I’m partial to Bosch/Vermont American.
Seth
It’s even difficult to differentiate branded cheap junk from obviously cheap junk – Dewalt’s drill bits are a great example of this. A set of 29 ‘titanium’ drill bits will run you $60, but the bits themselves break and shatter exactly like the chinese butter steel ‘tool shop’ bits available for $10. Seems to happen more with the smaller sizes, but I’ve had a ‘titanium’ 5/16ths bit have half of its flute shear off on the first use on aluminum. I expect better than that!
Blair
Small bits will always break off at some point, When I was a cabinet installer, we used to have at least 5, 1/8 bits per installer for any day. They break so quickly in hardwood (screwing cabinets together), and running to the local hardware store often was not an option, the nearest being 20 miles away.
skfarmer
i won’t argue that small bits break easy but the smaller dewalt bits break even easier. the one i broke last was 1/4 inch bit. i don”t consider that small and i have broken larger ones also.
SteveR
Tom–Not to rattle your cage, but how old was the DeWalt drill bit that broke? Was it new, or had it been used for awhile, and the bit was just dull? As with steak knives, if they get dull, you press harder and, especially on the smaller diameter bits, they snap. They break easily, even when they’re new. Also, what was the condition of the drill itself? If cordless, was the battery almost dead at this juncture? Even when it’s a new bit, do you tend to force it, rather than let it cut at its own pace? Be honest; we’ve all done that. And were you drilling into steel at the time? Were you using a drill press? I think it’s easier to snap a drill bit while using a hand drill than it is using a drill press. For one, you can see the bit deforming more readily on a drill press and would let up on it; secondly, we tend not to use a cutting oil with a hand drill, which would make the job easier AND reduce the heat build-up. As Edward R. Murrow once quoted, “The fault, dear Brutus, is not in the stars, but in ourselves “.
Tomas
In general terms I’d agree I look for a good price/performance ratio there’s usualy a sweet spot where you get good durability for a good price.
HOWEVER, I’ve bought some cheap stuff in the past, and as the typical city homeowner that drills the occasional holes, hangs some stuff and only rarely gets out something like a saw I have yet to have cheapy bits or other stuff break. Mostly it just doesn’t work as well as more expensive stuff but it DOES work without catastrophic failure.
The latest example is where I needed to drill two 2″ hole for wiring in a cabinet. I could have bought a nice Milwaukee set for $80 or a Dewalt for $130 but I went with the $9 black and decker
http://www.amazon.com/Black-Decker-71-120-5-Piece-Assortment/dp/B0009ZAEY8/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1396452348&sr=1-1&keywords=hole+saw
It got the job done for under $10 bucks, and considering that I’ll use this once in a blue moon (if ever) again that’s all I require.
Hang Fire
I’m a whatever works kind of person. It’s funny you mentioned Dremel cut-off wheels, I have a pack of 100 cheap imported fiber reinforced wheels that are larger, stronger, and (much, much) cheaper than Dremel’s, and came with several arbors. Love them. But I’ve also had problems with bad steel in drill bits, etc.
Most brands don’t mean a whole lot positive* to me because at any moment any of them can ditch QA and sell their brand value down the river for a quick buck. So what matters to me most is vendor return policy, user reviews, warranty support, and of course price/availability.
I do have a mental ranking, of course, Freud over Irwin for circular saw blades, for example, and Bosch over most everything else for jigsaw blades. But before buying a circular saw blade I still have to do research, because and internal brand differences. For example, Freud has different quality levels (with corresponding prices), I want to make sure I’m not buying the lower level blade for the higher level price.
*I say “positive” because some brands do have negative equity with me. I am prepared to try them again if they reform themselves, but others will have to be the pioneers.
Mac
Mostly agree with you all. Depends on many factors on which way I’ll go. And oh yeah, Unibits/step bits rock.
Jerry
Generally I go with most any name brand accessory, but when it comes to jigsaw blades, it is Bosch. I do, however, have a cheapo set of screwdriver insert bits, I use for loaners, mostly because about half the time whoever borrows them winds up losing a couple of the bits, and replaces them with whatever cheapos they can find. Nothing like loaning out your complete Wera insert set, to have it returned with 3-4 off brand tips in it.
AndrewC
When it comes to tool accessories, there is a vast difference in quality. In general, the cheapest stuff is almost unusable, but the most expensive accessories are not necessarily the best either. Over the years I have found articles/blog posts about a number of different accessories (oscillating tool blades, sawzall blades, jigsaw blades, sandpaper). I might be able to post the details later, but a summary:
oscillating tool blades – the name brand stuff is so expensive, the value play is to buy the cheap HF stuff, which wears out quickly, but will cut.
sawzall blades – pretty much all brands have some overpriced blades and some real value blades. I’ll have to find the particular models that work great but don’t cost an arm and a leg
jigsaw blades – Bosch makes the best stuff, and its also a good value.
Sandpaper – avoid the cheap HF stuff because they use cheap adhesives and the sandpaper will not last. A lot of the brands at the big box stores are way overpriced though. There are some professional brands that you can get online that are cheaper than the big box brands but perform better- will have to dig up the names.
Grinding/cut off wheels – like the sandpaper, the cheapest brands use poor adhesives. This is a safety issue, so don’t go cheap here.
joe
I tend to buy good quality tools that I will use a lot for work. Don’t really care much about quality when I need a weekend tool. Although I have found that some cheap tools actually really last a long time.
For example this air impact gun.
http://www.harborfreight.com/1-2-half-inch-pneumatic-impact-wrench-95310.html
I have used it a lot to do some car work and it still going strong. As a matter of fact, I saw in a forum a mechanic having the same gun that he was trying to fix. The reason it went bad was that there are some carbon fiber finds inside that has worn out…the rest of the stuff was good. Although I bought it in HF I have seen them surfacing in other areas under a different brand. I also bought along impact sets from HF and as far as I can tell the metal is harden. There is no metal deformation after many uses.
I also bought this torque wrench
http://www.harborfreight.com/1-2-half-inch-drive-click-type-torque-wrench-239.html
and has become very useful as a breaker bar. Those mechanics with their snap-on air impacts don’t follow the ft-lb recommendation when torqueing the auto wheels. I have noticed a couple of times that they over tighten them…when you get a flat or what to rotate your tires, you’ll be jumping up and down on the tool that it comes with the car.
Another thing is that I bought those tools cheaper than as current advertised since HF has tool sales all of the time.
Having said that, HF sell lots of crap too.
Joe M
Honestly? Truth be told? It depends. Being Canadian, I feel a little spoiled on this topic. Canadian Tire does have its “Mastercraft” house brand. Mass consumables that don’t necessarily matter? I’ll be happy to buy a Mastercraft, or a Jobmate, just to try it out. If I start to use it, or it teaches me that I need it more often, then I’ll look for the equivalent in a more trustworthy brand. Usually a brand with the same name as my tools its going in. And if it’s a tool I NEVER expect to use, but feel safer having one just in case I’m wrong? I have no problem with Mastercraft or Jobmate. Step Drill Bits? I’ve only ever used once. And they were Mastercraft brand, a 3-set for $9.99 on sale. No regrets. A 500 piece Rotary Tool Accessory set, with around 50 actual Accessories, and the rest Consumables for $40 on sale? No regrets.
I’m a devout Dremel and DeWalt user. I bought my first Cordless Circular Saw the past year or so. Just for variety, I picked up 3 on-sale Mastercraft Circular Saw blades, and 2 DeWalt branded Framing blades. I have no idea what I’ll use my saw for yet, so the variety is meant to teach me. Once I figure it out, I will probably go with DeWalt branded blades. That 500 piece Rotary Tool Accessory set I bought? When I was getting used to using my Dremel tools, I didn’t know what I’d use certain brushes or carvers for. As I went through them in the Mastercraft set, I would replace broken, or consumed ones with Dremel brand. And on the upside? The case for it is very convenient storage. In some cases, I’ll do Sibling-Company purchases. Stanley hand tools instead of DeWalt. Bosch instead of Dremel. I have the Dremel MultiSaw attachment for my Rotary Tools, and I’m quite happy to buy Bosch T-Shank blades for it. In fact, since Dremel doesn’t make blades, it’s pretty much the same thing anyways.
For many of my tools, I’m not certain what I’ll use it for on a regular basis. And many of my purchases are in the “It’s better to have it, and not need it, than to need it, and not have it” category. For much of those, I’m happy to go with off-brand until I learn how to use it properly. Once it needs replacing, I do the research to get the best brand for it.
Javier
I found out the hard way you need brand name accessories. No more harbor freight accessories for me
Coolfool
Just recently, had to tap 4 holes in stainless steel.
Had coworkers toolbox with a brand new “Craftsman Tap & Die” Set: did about half a first hole, and the tap felt like it was about to snap off. The Tap was lubricated and I went back and fourth a couple of times.
Then, I went and got a high quality Tap from the shop, that is is stocked by our onsite vendor. DID ALL 3 1/2 HOLES EASY!!! The tap was going through super easy!!!
I do not know the the name of the brand, but it definitely stomped craftsman set, and most of my home tools are craftsman. I’m looking for a Tap and Die set for my self; I know that I will be looking for a good quality set!
Regards.
DaveGuy
What about big box generics like HDX or Kobalt?