Dewalt has revealed their Ascent Series cordless mower, powered by a new PowerEquip battery system.
There are quite a few different products and technologies being introduced all at once, here’s a summary:
Dewalt Ascent Series: This will be a line of equipment that delivers a “total electric landscaping solution, with smart technology designed to ease the transition from gas to electric.”
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Dewalt PowerEquip: A new breed of battery will be needed to power the Ascent Series equipment. PowerEquip will be a battery subscription program that provides a customized battery supply to match real-world power needs.
Dewalt H-E-2: The new mower will feature a 60″ cutting deck and technology that “will take cut quality and performance to a new level.”
Dewalt GroundCommand: The web app will offer real-time and remote operational status of each machine.
The first Ascent Series cordless mower (C-60) will feature a H-E-2 high efficiency cutting deck, with 3 spindles, each with dual-blade technology and 4 cutting surfaces.
The 60″ deck is said to be engineered for easier airflow to help process and clear grass while avoiding clumping.
PowerEquip consists of 60V 3.2kWh lithium ion batteries that can be swapped in and out of the equipment for all-day runtime.
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Dewalt plans to offer a battery subscription program to help landscapers reduce upfront battery investments compared to purchasing batteries.
The subscription program will offer provide easy battery exchanges and support.
The Ascent mower can hold up to 5 batteries. Given the specs provided, that means each mower can pack up to a whopping 16kWh of energy on-board.
For comparison purposes, Dewalt’s largest cordless power tool battery to date, their FlexVolt 15Ah battery, holds 0.30 kWh of energy.
Thus, a single Dewalt PowerEquip battery has more than 10X the energy storage of a FlexVolt 15Ah battery.
With all of an Ascent mower’s battery slots filled, it can draw from more than 53X the energy storage of a single FlexVolt 15Ah battery.
Or, an Ascent mower can be equipped with the Li-ion battery-powered energy capacity of 160 18V/20V Max 5Ah batteries.
With this in mind, the battery subscription program sounds like a good idea.
The first Ascent Series mower, the C-60, will have 2-in-1 crossover functionality where operators can convert it from a standing mower to a sit-down mower and back.
A sit-only model, R-60, will also be available.
Dewalt says that their PowerEquip batteries can be charged in multiple ways to ensure that landscapers never run out of power on the job.
They mention that there will be a charging trailer, a wall-mounted charger, and a charging cart that allows for easy battery swapping in the field.
Is this the tech that professional landscapers have been waiting for?
Many brands have expressed interest in “electrifying” the commercial landscaping industry, but the battery technology has not gotten there yet. Most landscapers today still largely rely on gasoline-engine equipment.
The new Ascent Series and PowerEquip products are set to debut in Fall 2023.
Is this a glimpse at the future of professional landscaping equipment? What else might Dewalt’s massively powerful PowerEquip batteries power?
Here’s the intro video:
ca
Is this backwards compatible with my impact driver? Changing the battery every few days has become tiresome.
Jared
Ha.
Kevin
Beat me to it
Micah
Exactly my thoughts as well 🤣
E
You might want to wait on using these batteries. Watch this YouTube video showing this mower catch on fire at the Equip Expo:
Youtube Video
Stuart
FYI, your link included your corporate email address – I fixed this for you.
Please be careful and sanitize your links.
STRETCH
This is the one that caught on fire at the demo right?!
Jared
Surprise! That’s a big development.
Interesting that Dewalt came out with what must be an MX Fuel competitor, but targeted a completely different audience.
With the kind of capacity that mower is packing it seems like it ought to be able to achieve beyond-gas power.
Eric
It’s not surprising that Dewalt chose a different market to launch their own version of MX sized batteries. A lot of the stuff on the MX platform has a relatively small market. And I would imagine by now that they’ve already pretty heavily saturated it. Sure people will keep buying as their gas powered stuff hits end of life. But the early adopters and people that needed electric versions have mostly made the jump already. Better to launch in a new category with a wide open market full of people looking to ditch gas powered equipment due to all the noise and emissions regulations that are popping up all over the place. Makes a much bigger splash then just starting to make similar stuff to a competitor that has owned the market for a couple of years.
neandrewthal
These are about 7X the capacity of MX fuel XC batteries.
JMKing
Figured that something like this would happen after SBD acquired MTD. Wonder if DeWalt will branch out into other markets with the PowerEquip platform.
Collin
This is in no way an MX Fuels competitor.
These DeWalt 60v batteries with 3200 watt have massive capacities.
The MX Fuel 72v batteries top out at 432 watt hours.
A single DeWalt battery has the energy of 7.4 MX Fuel packs. The large one. 15 of the smaller packs.
Jared
It’s not lost on me that these Dewalt batteries leapfrogged MX Fuel’s capacity, but I still think it’s a competitor. I suspect Milwaukee will “make do” with their smaller batteries, but it won’t limit them from reaching into the same space as Dewalt.
E.g. maybe Milwaukee won’t have the headspace to make behemoth mowers with their smaller battery, but if Milwaukee wanted to make a zero turn mower, doesn’t it seem likely they would base it off the MX Fuel platform – or are you thinking there’s another platform in Milwaukee’s future?
Luke
Just based on these numbers, I don’t see how MX could possibly compete here. They’re just leagues apart.
Collin
Milwaukee will have to make do with MX Fuel and its inherent limitations, just as Milwaukee has had to make do with M18 and its inherent limitations.
Milwaukee has had plenty of success in making do with M18 and its inherent limitations, but I doubt that Milwaukee will have such similar success in the now thoroughly matured lithium-ion battery tool and equipment market. It’s no longer just TTI and SBD on the block. There are plenty of Chinese companies like Chervon, Greenworks, etc. ready to eat TTI’s lunch.
—-
M12/M18 aren’t going to cut it for the commercial OPE sector. The M18 mower is barely relevant to commercial OPE. I see pros using stand-on ZTRs mainly. That’s why Greenworks is working on stand-on ZTRs, as well as DeWalt. Ego probably is, too, behind the scenes for now.
The old Greenworks stand-on ZTR also has 16,000 watt-hours of energy onboard. Identical to the new DeWalt. The new Greenworks 48″, 52″, and 60″ ZTRs (introduced 2 days ago at Green Expo) have 18,000 watt-hours of energy or 24,000 watt-hours of energy on board. The smaller 32″ and 36″ ZTRs have 8,000 watt-hours of energy on board.
In short: It really looks like 16,000 watt-hours of energy is a sort of baseline or benchmark for commercially viable ZTRs.
Milwaukee has a few options here if they’re actually looking to expand into commercial OPE. Not only does Milwuakee lack a viable ZTR but they also lack a truly commercial-grade chainsaw. Their 16″ chainsaw is a pittance compared to what’s available to OPE professionals on other platforms.
1) Multiple MX Fuel batteries. Largest MX Fuel battery has a capacity of only 432 watt hours. To get to 16,000 watt-hours they will need 37 of the larger MX Fuel packs, or 74 of the smaller packs.
2) Ignore larger ZTRs altogether and focus on smaller mowers. 8000 watt-hours can be delivered by a mere 18 MX Fuel batteries.
3) Ignore ZTRs altogether and just focus on pushing their $999 21″ self-propelled lawn mower.
Domdymond
Keep in mind dewalts is actually 54v. Or you could say milwaukee MX is 82v “MAX”
That’s probably why dewalt didn’t try on milwaukees platform area, it would be a HARD battle higher voltage usually means less heat for a given output.
I use both dewalt and milwaukee 50/50 but no mx stuff. All of my dewalt big items are 60v like the cutoff saw wormdrive and angle grinder.
Bonnie
I don’t think these are really the same category as MX Fuel. These packs seem very specifically for large stand-alone equipment, not anything handheld (maybe some backpack tools) whereas MX Fuel still supports a bunch of large handheld tools.
MX Fuel seems to lineup more with FlexVolt (x2 for larger semi-portable tools).
Brad+Justinen
This is a replacement for gas. MX fuel is more of a replacement for 110v.
Jeff
This is the future and dewalt is getting there. The cafe subscription is a great idea for someone like me that doesn’t know what I need. Well written article!
Stuart
That’s not what the subscription program is for – the subscription sounds like a battery leasing or incremental payment type of program to me.
TomD
Subscription/lease screams to me “the sticker shock of buying it outright would kill people” and so they’re going for a Total-Cost-of-Ownership angle instead.
Birdog357
So the Dewalt demo mower at the equipment expo in Louisville burned to the ground today…
OhioHead
Source?
Ecotek
Seriously?
Birdog357
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fpUXu_NYPtoZprwpG5skS0BpSObvsyeG/view?usp=drivesdk
G New
Looking at online reports of this, its NOT the electric, its the Kawasaki gas powered unit. Hot gas motor, a ton of hay, you have a chance of fire.
Birdog357
I’m just going off what the guys that took the pictures said. They came from two different FB groups
G New
A post a ProToolReviews does list it as the prototype electric that burst into flames. So conflicting information, but its looking like the Electric unit is the one on fire.
Big Richard
They pulled the press release from their website. And their seems to be a good amount of first hand witnesses saying it was indeed the new battery mower.
Stuart
@Big Richard – yes, but the live landing page remains – https://www.dewalt.com/ascent
Lenny
Looks like a scene out of Ghost Rider.
STRETCH
It was the electric. That’s why the firefighters wernt spraying it down with water
Birdog357
This one is a completely different source https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fr30B-9VfjCleNRox2qdeAIGQIUmZNYp/view?usp=drivesdk
MFC
“We are happy to announce the release of our new battery platform…
{Explosion and Flames in the background}
…In 2023!
Big Richard
The release date was already announced as fall 2023, it may be fall 2024 or beyond now.
MFC
It was a joke Big R. 😏
Big Richard
I get that, I was saying the joke more accurately would have been:
“We are happy to announce the release of our new battery platform coming in Twenty Twenty Thr.…
{Explosion and Flames in the background}
…Four!!”
Roger
Battery alternative to reduce carbon emotions… Emits large amounts of carbon.
Collin
External combustion engine
Raymond
🤣🤣🤣
Tim D.
HA!
Jack Smith
I just want a basic push mower that uses two regular 60v batteries to cut my yard. Their regular mower is not that great, only 20×2 volt and I’m waiting for an updated model. Because when my 15+ year old gas powered breaks down I will probably be getting a Ryobi, which I’d rather not do since I’m on the DeWalt system.
I’m probably going to stick with gas for a few more years unless some super deal comes along. I don’t even do proper maintenance at all and that thing just keeps running. I waited 14 years to change the oil the first time haha. Boy was that oil black.
The reason for the subscription service on those batteries is because they are going to cost thousands of dollars a piece. I’ll tell you one thing DeWalt better hope they got it right for this large of an investment. If they did not get it right, the public will find out. The reviewers had better need to nitpick to find complaints.
TomD
The Milwaukee mower has been pleasant to use for me, but I’ve a smallish lawn.
Thing is way heavier than I thought it would be however. No wonder it’s power assist.
Stuart
(Milwaukee went with a metal deck for aerodynamic purposes, which add to its heft.)
MM
I have the front-wheel-drive 2x20V Dewalt mower. I use it to get into the small areas that my big ZTR won’t fit into. I don’t think it’s a fantastic mower, I’d give it a solid “Okay” rating. Not bad, not great. It does what I need it to do: mow the tight spots and share batts with my power tools. I bought the inexpensive kit which came with 2x 10ah 20V max batts. Now that said, I don’t have any complaints in the power department and runtime has been good too. My only real complaint is the front-wheel drive. If I had a smaller yard where I was mowing all of it with a walk-behind I think I’d have bought the RWD model with the flexvolt batteries instead and I’m sure that would do great.
Rx9
There is a tipping point where swappable batteries become too big to be practical, which is why all almost all power tools have them and almost all electric cars don’t. This rides right at the edge of that point. A Zero turn mower is a good application, but will it have the sales volume needed to support the system?
The need for a high enough total system sales volume was enough to prompt a swappable battery standard (dubbed “Gachaco”) amongst the four largest Japanese motorcycle manufacturers. I can’t help but think adopting a standard like this or the Taiwanese Gogoro standard would have led to greater economies of scale.
Hopefully, there will be more applications for PowerEquip, but if as big a corporation as Honda Motor sought out alliances, it may be time for Stanley Black and Decker to follow suit.
Alliances with firms in the motorcycle/powersports sector, defense contractors, and/or mining equipment vendors may be a good way to get the. PowerEquip system a boost.
For brand recognition alone, partnership with the mighty Tesla would really get the ball rolling, although I’m not sure how that arrangement would work.
Mike
If this system works the voltage is perfect for ebikes, scooters and maybe even small motorcycles.
I could love seeing a sit down vespa type vehicle with 2 of these batteries under the seat.
That said these are going to be expen$ive.
TonyT
Yeah, look at the price of decent e-bikes (easily >$3K) and electric motorcycles (cheapest I’ve seen is $17K, rest are >$20K).
JoeM
…0-Degree Turn Forklift… Bobcat-Style Multi-Utility Mini-Plow/Lift/Dozer… Mini Excavator with Cab-Activated Arm Tools, like Power Chisel, Dual Jaw, and Single Jaw Buckets, Crane Lift (Cherry-Picker Style for Engines.)…
I’m just thinking what other vehicles this system might support full time. It just seems like they are better suited to vehicle-based tools, where Milwaukee are Specialty-Operator style tools for their MX Fuel line. I don’t think we can compare the two systems just yet. There appears to be very little crossover in form factor, although both are extreme upgrades to their respective company’s well known tools.
I don’t have a lawn, but if I was a homeowner with a big enough yard space to maintain… this looks like a better option to invest in than a John Deere, though the multi-deck and drive-on systems of John Deere are pulling a lot of value to their weight class…
…I think the test we need to see for this new power system would be a single-battery Mower Drone, with attachments for patching dead spots, fertilizing, aerating the soil, etc. If they can achieve an iRobot style Roomba the size of one of these riding mowers… It would prove it’s worthy of being called “The Future”… And, no, it wouldn’t negate the job of the person normally riding it… Said Drone would need some manual overrides in case something glitched and suddenly a prize-winning flower garden has been targeted to be mulched… They’ll need someone to hop on, grab the controls, and take the extra-delicate tasks on themselves as a fallback. We need to see if this is possible with this new battery system before we can truly say what future potential it has.
And, yes… I’m a DeWALT guy, and I just said the DeWALT system needs to prove itself against Milwaukee, John Deere, Bobcat, and even iRobot, before it’s worth getting too excited about. Yes, excitement I have… but I need more to go on before singing its praises over… Two? Mowers? Same form factor Mowers? Need to see more. The corkscrew/zero turning radius Forklift for warehouses… That would show me they’re significantly more serious…
Jared
Existing homeowner-grade electric mowers are already 2x the price of comparable gas-powered machines (well, maybe not TWICE exactly, but that’s the ballpark). This Dewalt mower packs many times the the power and capacity of existing electric zero turn mowers.
With that in mind, I think it’s going to be a long time before there’s a version even close to a price that makes sense for “a homeowner with a big enough yard space”.
Instead, I think this will be aimed first at (large) contractors in areas with noise and fuel restrictions (didn’t we recently discuss an area were gas-powered yard maintenance tools were being phased out?).
Plus, given just how much power this unit is packing, maybe Dewalt can have it make a degree of financial sense for a lawn care company who wants to save on labour costs by having a mower that can cut faster, requires no warm-up, doesn’t need oil changes, etc.
MM
I have a few acres to maintain, so that’s probably in the area of a “homeowner with a big yard”. Though I am in a rural area so my “lawn” is closer to a field than it is to a fancy neighborhood. I currently use a 62″ commercial ZTR. If that mower suddenly vanished and I had to buy a new machine today there’s no way I’d consider the Ascent. My fuel costs are negligible compared to the cost of those batteries. No way I’d break even, or anything close. I’d save a lot of money sticking with gas even though I suspect that would be the opposite for a pro landscaper.
So what would I buy if I had to do it again? Compact tractor. No question. I don’t need the super nice cut quality of the ZTR, but I’d *love* to have a loader.
TomD
California is banning various gas-powered outdoor power equipment, and if they haven’t banned riding mowers yet it’s obviously coming.
So the manufacturers will be trying to get out ahead of that.
Ryan
They’ve banned motors under 25hp, his mower is likely about that output. Kawasaki has a 23.5hp motor on a lot of ZTR mowers. They’ll just upsize the motors to 25hp to sidestep the new regulations. I have a ZTR with a 25hp Kohler motor, which will still be permitted in CA. There’s no battery mower under $15k that can match the quality of my ZTR.
Steve
I would expect more cities to start banning gasoline-powered commercial lawn equipment in residential areas (noise and air pollution), and tool makers need to be in the right place to get that market when it comes.
Brian
Big question is will other SBD labels use this same platform for lawn mowers or will this be DeWalt specific. Curious to see what happens with Cub Cadet.
Collin
It’s very interesting that this DeWalt mower has up to 16,000 watt hours of energy onboard.
I know Ego also wants to be the future of professional landscaping, but their batteries sort of pale in comparison with these DeWalt monstrosities.
16,000 / 56 volts / 12 amp hours = 23.8 Ego 12ah battery packs.
So for Ego to have the same energy capacity, they’ll need to have a mower accepting 24 Ego 12ah battery packs.
6 or 8 or even 10 is probably okay, but asking a Pro to charge, store, and insert 24 battery packs into their electric Ego ZTR seems like major hassle. Obviously, Ego could just run their ZTR on fewer batteries, but that means less runtime. And that might tip the scales in favor of DeWalt.
It’ll be interesting to see how Ego tackles ZTR mowers.
Doresoom
Counterpoint: the cost of one EGO battery dying vs one DeWalt battery dying. Maybe that’s why DeWalt is looking into a subscription service.
Bonnie
The existing EGO ZTR seems pretty firmly in the consumer camp, maybe prosumer at a stretch, definitely not aiming for landscaping crews.
If we do see a commercial-marketed EGO ZTR it would probably use, or herald a replacement for, their backpack cells (28ah) rather than their portable tool batteries.
MFC
NUMBER CRUNCHING TIME! WOOOH!
So Ego’s 42″ mower can cut 3 acres on six of their 10ah packs (3.36kwh) so DeWalt’s should be able to handle around 14 acres with 5 batteries (16kwh). It has a larger cutting deck and should cut more grass because it’s covering more ground per pass, which is a drain on the batteries regardless of cutting width, so it could be 15+ acres.
However, a single 10ah ego pack (560 watts) will set you back $500 in store. A 15ah flexvolt battery (270-300 watts) is $389. An MX Fuel 6ah battery (432wh) is $649.
That averages out between manufacturers to about $1.22 per watt hour which would put a single 3.2kwh battery around $3900, or the cost of a new gas zero turn. A tesla 50kwh battery is around $7500, or $.15 per wh.
So I would imagine with one pack its price would be around $8,000 to be competitively marketed, and adding enough batteries to keep up with a standard landscaping business cutting 8 acres in a day would require 2-3 batteries, so $8000 +$7800 = Mucho Dinero.
The battery rental program begins to make sense at that point if that is the true price point, which I would expect it to be a lot lower like Tesla.
However, a gas mower that mows 1000 hours will consume about a gallon per hour around that deck size cutting average grass, so about $3000+ in gas per 6 months if you were on it every day for 8 hours. Electricity isn’t free, but currently in my area it’s $0.11 per kwh, so for 1000 hours at the expected rate of cut that I already calculated, basing a 1 acre per hour cut at about 1000kwh per acre you would use 8000kwh per day x 120 days = 960kwh or about $105.
I can assure you that this will be marketed to the landscapers if my math is correct.. And maybe it’s more like $.50 per watt or $1500 per battery. It could save you money the first year on gas so as to help pay for the higher priced mower, and if they give you a subscription program so that you’re “leasing” the batteries, then it could work out for both parties and you don’t have to worry about a $1500+ battery dying after a couple of years.
All of this is based off some “guesstimates” so more numbers and real world data would be needed, but I can actually see this making sense if the rest of the mower is built well.
Bob
Your math certainly sounds in the ballpark. In addition to the gas savings they will be oil change savings. Those add up. Guys should be changing oil at least once a week if they are mowing full time.
A Walker brand zero turn with grass handling system and 48” inch deck is in the $20k to $25k price range. That’s at the higher end of the professional landscaper mower spectrum. If the DeWalt comes in at 15 to 18k that puts them in a pretty competitive price point, assuming it works as well as a gas mower
Big Richard
There also is up to a $7500 tax credit for commercial users, it was mentioned in their official press release which has since been redacted..
TonyT
A lot depends on the price of electricity. Here in PG&E land, I’m paying >$0.30/KWHr, and it goes up from there. (Of course, gas costs more here, too).
S
The math makes sense to me. The bigger question is going to be the ecosystem around the batteries.
Any lawn company trailer I see always has 2 mowers, 2 blowers, and 2 weed whackers minimum.
Is DeWalt going to release a blower and weed whacker on the same system, or expect owners to buy into other DeWalt variants?
The biggest thing is going to be the upfront costs. If the mower+ battery is creating $20k/ea, making some cost assumptions, a typical 2-of-everything layout could start easily cresting $80-100k, and that’s not even including the truck, trailer, or consumables.
If the gas version is $6k for 2 mowers, and let’s go crazy and say $10k for ultra grade 2 blowers and weed eaters, $16k is a whole lot easier to deal with. Easier to finance as well.
Granted, there’s more consumables, but I’d be very interested to see the break-even point of a full setup. I suspect even with higher gas prices, it’s going to encroach on the 8-10 year mark, which is an eternity in business.
Birdog357
They ain’t gonna be that cheap. The closest electric mower equivalent to my $20k Hustler Hyperdrive is half as capable and costs twice as much.
Marko
Sorry, but the electrical engineer in me screams foul here: “that means each mower can pack up to a whopping 16kw of power on-board”.
I assume you meant 5*3.2kWh = 16kWh of “energy”. Also, notice the uppercase “W”.
Somebody may say I am nitpicking here, but considering the wide-spread confusion about power and energy I am sure you do not want to contribute to it. You have always been very accurate in your articles and I hope you don’t mind me correcting you this time.
Stuart
Isn’t that what I wrote? Hold on. Oops! Thank you, *fixed*, and the capitalization too.
Ah = charge capacity
W = power
Wh = energy
I got the words right for all other instances, though.
I always appreciate corrections!
As for nitpicking, that’s allowed too, and has led to some memorable comment interactions. Vibration dampening vs damping remains my favorite.
Artūras
Husqvarna has a back pak with batteries, if you make a backpack, put there this 3,2 kWh battery, some adapters for 60V tools, so you could use for example blower or chainsaw for a long long time.
Joe H
I want to see a cordless dump cart in this line, also a snowblower,maybe a brush cutter, and small wood/yard waste chipper. Maybe a little wood splitter?
Virgil N
At Equip Expo, there’s a Dewalt 9 ton wood splitter running on two 60v batteries. I didn’t get to talk to anyone to see about availability, but it looks like a real live unit.
Big Richard
9 ton sounds decent, considering most 110v AC models are 5-7 tons. Hydraulic ram or kinetic?
VN
Hydraulic. Rumor is there might be a 25 ton 60 volt coming as well. Might be released Fall 2023.
MM
Agreed, I’d love a dump/yard cart or even an electric version of a mini-skid aka “dingo”.
I don’t need a splitter but that would be easily done with this kind of battery power.
David
This expensive heavy ass mower will be perfect for making ruts in your less than arid yard.
Pass.
Hon Cho
Rest assured that the product team at DeWalt has crunched the numbers on the economics. This is clearly aimed at commercial mowing operations, particularly in California where the under 25hp ICE ban is just a couple of years off.
As for homeowners, ICE is probably still the most economical way to go for a few more years but there will be the folks who highly value the lack of engine maintenance , low noise and no emissions who will pay the premium for electric equipment in the meantime.
MM
Agreed.
I don’t think this will make much financial sense for most homeowners, even those with large properties, but for a pro landscaper the cost of the batteries may very well be justified by the fuel savings. Not to mention there’s the legal angle you mentioned.
Tj
Here is a Dewalt zero turn on fire.
The post is on Paula’s Tool Pig account.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cj6qXpQJm5N/?igshid=MDJmNzVkMjY=
Bob
As has been mentioned before that’s the gasoline powered one. Look at the ROP’s bar. It’s black, not yellow like on the electric. it’s a different machine.
Birdog357
I just got a hold of a better pic, it says prototype on it, and you can see the electric motors on the deck.
Birdog357
It’s black because the paint was burned off. These are electric motors on the deck. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fz5w2s9zBVY4_tJNlfCiqk9vaGfkLZd7/view?usp=sharing
Bob
I like the ability to switch from stander to sit down position.
If it works half decently this should be a home run in certain markets.
Savvy lawn care businesses can promote green energy usage. I mean it’s obviously a lie but most of marketing is lol. Noise pollution will be less possibly. Commercial mowers spin the blades at much higher speeds do it’s definitely going to be louder than your average Eggo push mower. I’d like to see a decibel reading on this Dewalt.
I wonder if the cost of the machine as well as the batteries is part of the leasing system? A ton of lawn care businesses utilize factory credit terms. Just look at your average 19 year old lawn care professional with a brand new truck, brand new mower and brand new trailer. Trust me he’s leverage to the hilt!
Badger12345
I have some relatives that used to own a commercial landscaping and mowing business. They have wanted something like this for years as long as they get all day power. The challenge is that many of their customers were facilities like medical clinics, therapy offices, dental offices, law firms, accounting firms, etc. The professionals in the facilities complained the big commercial mowers they were using were too loud and distracting to their work, so the landlord(s) asked for them to start mowing “off hours” which really doesn’t work. They were able to swap out their gas powered trimmers and blowers with battery powered ones that were significantly quieter. However, there wasn’t a good substitute for gas mowers. They tried using machines with enhanced mufflers with marginal success and none of the current battery powered mowers (too small) were suitable for a business operating on razor thin margins. This could be a game changer for a commercial landscaper serving select customers. Of course, the proof is in field testing. They sold the business to a big firm and went into a new line of work.
Birdog357
I’m a commercial landscaper. I did the math, it would take a Tesla model S battery to get the same energy as the gas I burn in a given day.
neandrewthal
A Tesla model S has the energy equivalent of about 3 gallons of gas.
Birdog357
That assumes 100% efficiency conversion from gas to energy. An ICE is only 20-30% efficient. For reference, I burn 1.5-2.5 gals per hour on my mower and have 12 gals of fuel. So 4-5 hours of hard running or 8 of easy running.
neandrewthal
That’s my point. This doesn’t need 100Kwh to be equal to your use case. But the answer might be more than 16Kwh. Greenworks has 24Kwh and promises a full day of hard mowing.
Electric commercial mowers might make sense if you truly run for 1440 hours a year, burning 2gph and having $15,000 in fuel costs a year.
Birdog357
I told you how many joules I actually use. I already allowed for the inherent efficiency losses. I would need the that many kw/hrs to make it though a day even with the 90+% efficiency that electric would provide. I’m running a 66″ mulching mower with a 37hp Kawi. There aren’t any two battery machines combined that can equal what I can do now.
neandrewthal
I’m curious if that’s the case. The greenworks 24Kwh 60″ has more power so could possibly mow faster, but despite their claims may not last a work day. And the question about the joules- how do you know this number? I think you may be assuming an efficiency number you don’t know. At 2 gph you may be averaging 10HP of output. Maybe less even. That’s pretty hard to calculate since the mower will burn something, maybe 1 gph when running but putting zero energy into the blades. An ICE engine is 20-30+% efficient, but during use a mower may average closer to 10%.
Birdog357
It’s a 37hp Kawi, 10HP isn’t even enough to move the machine, much less turn the deck. I pulled the percentages off google. Since I don’t just sit there at high idle, the fuel burn is real work getting done. I know that I have to vary my ground speed to keep the RPMs up at times, so I know I’m getting full rated power out of the engine.
neandrewthal
37HP will burn about 3 GPH, so yes you’re probably getting pretty close to peak. I’m honestly just really curious how these large electric mowers will compare.
KokoTheTalkingApe
That never occurred to me! That’s a great point. I know many municipalities are passing noise ordinances, which can also make ICE equipment less feasible. On top of that, I’ve heard some areas are restricting air pollution from small ICE engines. And then there’s the higher operating cost (but lower purchase price) of ICE equipment.
Nathan
how long before all the Dewalt commercial mower and landscape equipment is named cub cadet to get away from this publicity quagmire?
Meanwhile This is certainly a commercial tool and it addresses concerns I’ve heard people say on the GreenMAchine and other electric prosumer mowers. Dewalt and EGO weren’t the first by the way. (I think the name of the company was green machine or big mean green or such)
The others on the market to day have installed batteries to recharge. This fixes one aspect of when the battery is near dead you need to move it to a charger – in the dewalt you could go get another suitcase battery (a bit like the makita we made fun of) and at least move the machine.
I like the premise. How much does one battery weigh – will it become a backback item such as to power a blower vac. backpack battery to run a trimmer, brush cutter, etc – like the stihl and husquvarna systems?
Stuart
There was a mishap with a prototype that was transported a long distance – it happens.
It’s better for something like this to happen now, rather than with production models.
The line is set to launch Fall 2023. That means that for most of the country the tools will be first available for the Spring 2024 growth season.
I’m sure there will be extensive testing and refinement between now and then.
MM
Everybody has covered the battery tech pretty well with all the obvious questions and suggestions. One thing I’m curious about is how Dewalt (and others, frankly) plan on addressing the bottleneck that is charging all these huge batteries.
These new batteries have more than 10x the capacity of a 15ah Flexvolt….which means that if they charge at the same rate, they also take more than 10x as long to charge. If these are meant for a pro landscaping contractor then that contractor needs a method of making sure that all his batteries are recharged before the start of work the next day then that problem needs to be addressed. I hope they have a 240v powered charger in the works similar to what is used for electric car charging.
Bonnie
One of the images shows a graphic of a wall charger that certainly looks like a Level 2 EV charger. The article also mentions plans for dedicated charging carts and trailers, so it seems they’ve thought it through.
Bob
Charging trailer? So it’s a diesel generator? That would be ironic lol
MM
In an earlier topic about gas OPE bans were were discussing the humorous option of operating corded OPE via an obnoxiously loud generator. I wonder what would happen if someone rolled up to a landscape job in California with 100% electric equipment and a “Screamin’ Jimmy” genset to power it all?
Though in all seriousness, equipping the truck with an oversize or extra alternator (commonly done for Ambulances and some work trucks), or a PTO-driven generator, would allow the batteries in the trailer to charge more or less for “free” from extra engine power while the truck drives from site to site. That’s not a bad idea.
John+D
Not really, the cost benefit ratio plummets if you use gasoline as an energy source. Power from utilities is cheaper because it is more efficiently produced and delivered than gasoline.
MM
You’re correct that power from utilities is cheaper than gasoline, but that wasn’t really what I was talking about there. Most of the time when a truck or car is driving around it is already wasting power because most of the time the engine makes more power than is actually needed to move the vehicle forward. If some of that power can be recovered by driving an alternator via the fan belt or a generator via a transmission PTO it’s essentially “free”.
You could think of it a bit like a Hybrid car. In a hybrid car any excess engine power is used to charge the battery as it becomes available, same basic idea here. There’s not necessarily enough “free” power like this to charge the batteries at their optimal or even a significant rate, but if it’s free why not use it?
Munklepunk
A few years ago I saw a video of DeWalt having backup batteries for electric cars, like carrying a gas can. You kept them in the trunk and plugged then in. Batteries this size could be used like that.
Brian Bisceglia-Kane
Dear Santa,
Please make a dewalt battery operated snowblower. Pleaaaaaase.
Thanks,
Brian
Micah
I’ve been waiting forever for this. I’m super close to purchasing an EGO snowblower and a DeWALT battery converter…
Collin
There’s a DeWalt to Ego converter?
Frank
.3kwh into 16kwh goes A HELLOFA LOT MORE than ten times… Some people here failed math class 👎👎
Stuart
In the post, it says:
Single = one (1) 3.2kWh battery.
All slots filled = five (5) 3.2kWh batteries, or 16kWh total.
3.2 divided by 0.3 is a little more than 10.
16 divided by 0.3 is a little more than 53.
Mistakes happen to the best of us, and I try not to say anything that could make a commentor feel bad.
But in this case, I must insist that you improve your reading comprehension skills and double check your accuracy before you say something like “some people here failed math class” again.
Big Richard
EDIT:
“Single = one (1) 3.2Ah battery.
All slots filled = five (5) 3.2Ah batteries, or 16kWh total.”
Should be Wh, not Ah. I think you also forgot to double check your accuracy. We all do it.
Big Richard
And I did it right there….kWh
Stuart
Thanks!
That was either browser or mental auto-correct hiccup. But the math is still right!
Kingsley
16kwh is bigger than the battery in my Mitsubishi Outlander plug-in hybrid and that’s got a 25 mile range with 12kwh.
How long before Dewalt produce a small city car powered by these?
Also, 3kwh is the same sort of capacity that a lot of solar battery storage systems start at. They normally cost $1000’s
Collin
That 25 miles with 12kwh is in part due to your car’s ability to recharge the 12kwh battery during braking.
As far as I know, no battery ZTR has regenerative braking.
Ted Geiger
How much? Guarantee it will carry an outrageous price tag and I imagine extra batteries will be a small fortune??? Tell us the price of mowers and extra batteries.
Stuart
Pricing hasn’t been announced yet.
mike
well, ok
so what is the status of this ??
release date / prices
etc…
thx !
Birdog357
Probably still trying to fix the whole “burning to the ground” thing…
mike
@ Stuart
can you follow up on this and try to get more details
more than a year now since partial press release
thx
mike
Stuart
Will see what I can do!
Big Richard
They unveiled it at Equip Expo 2022 last October, there is a good chance they will have some updates at this year’s Equip Expo, October 17-20.
https://www.equipexposition.com/