Festool has a new “Quadrive” 18V cordless hammer drill that they’ve been promoting as their “best drill ever.”
I reported briefly on the new Festool Quadrive hammer drill last month, in a post about several new Festool tools and accessories.
Festool is also launching an updated track saw, an updated router, updated guide rail accessories, a Bluetooth speaker tool box that launched overseas 2 years ago, and updated vacuum accessories.
Advertisement
I keep waiting for Festool PR to provide some context, as they’ve been promoting the drill on social media for weeks now, but there’s been nothing so far.
The big thing about this Festool 18V “Quadrive” hammer drill is that it has a 4-gear mechanism that offers drilling speeds up to 3600 RPM.
The max torque is… a meager 442.5 in-lbs. How utterly underwhelming.
Update/Correction 3/28: Festool USA advertises 442.5 in-lbs as the max driving torque, but they have additional torque (but not speed) specs on a technical data page: Max torque wood/steel: 442.5 in-lb / 663.8 in-lb (50/75 Nm).
Retailer listings say that the Festool Quadrive offers:
the best gear change you have ever operated
Advertisement
From product photos, the gear change looks simple, but awkward. Are users going to be able to change gears while wearing gloves?
The drill features a brushless motor, anti-kickback tech, and a FastFix modular attachment interface.
The kit is priced at $549, including a Systainer 3 tool box, charger, and 2x 4Ah batteries.
As for the attachments, you get a drill chuck, right angle drill chuck, and a bit holder.
Festool says that the new TPC 18/4 hammer drill delivers “More torque compared to the previous model for greater rotational torque with 5/16 In. (8 mm) screws.”
Microprocessors monitor and control the temperature, voltage and current consumption of the motor, electronics and battery.
Just like every other brushless cordless drill on the market today?
No other cordless hammer drill offers this much variety!
Taking this at face value, perhaps not, but you can equip an even more versatile and capable kit for the same $549.
How important is variety if a cordless drill lacks the muscle for higher torque applications?
Here’s how they describe the 3 different speed ranges:
- 1st gear: Demanding tightening of screws up to 3/8″ (10 mm)
- 2nd gear: Quick screwdriving up to 5/16″ x 11-13/32″ (8 x 300 mm) in size
- 3rd gear: Powerful drilling with auger bits of up to 3/4″ (20 mm)
- 4th gear: Quick drilling with medium and small drill bits up to 1-3/8″ (35 mm), for example Forstner drill bits.
The first gear is going to be high torque mode, and the fourth gear is going to be the high speed mode. The other gear settings are somewhere in the middle.
Most cordless drills do their best larger-diameter spade bit and auger drilling at lower torque modes. More powerful cordless drills can perform well at higher speeds as well, but lower powered drills usually falter.
Faster drill speeds are often used for smaller diameter drill bits, not “auger bits up to 3/4-inch.” 3600 RPM also exceeds the recommended speeds for larger drilling accessories.
You don’t need a lot of power for drilling through OSB or single sheets of plywood, but it takes a lot more power to drill solid wood, steel, and masonry materials, especially at higher speeds.
We are confident that this is the best drill that Festool has ever built!
That may be, but while this might be Festool’s best cordless drill, it doesn’t look very competitive.
The Quadrive feature is the main feature, but it looks awkward to use – at the least for glove-wearers – and it seems compromised from the start with limited power.
Festool makes some great tools, but this looks to be solely aimed at Festool 18V loyalists that don’t want to have to buy into another brand’s cordless system.
I keep waiting for something to change my mind.
One more thing – where’s the adjustable torque clutch?! Festool tools are often aimed at cabinetry, carpentry, and fine woodworking applications, right? So how do you adjust the torque for when you want to drive fasteners to repeatable depths? There’s usually a small dial somewhere, but where is it in this drill?
Update 3/28: It seems that there is a clutch dial located at the rear of the handle, close to the battery connection.
I usually recognize the utility of Festool products, and have purchased some of their problem-solving and frustration-easing tools and accessories. But here, I fail to see the appeal of this new Festool Quadrive hammer drill.
Maybe the problem is that I cannot see who could benefit from this drill, aside from users exclusively committed to Festool’s limited 18V cordless power tool system exclusively.
Would you use this? Why might you choose this over all of the other cordless drills currently on the market today?
Price: $549 for the Kit (576778)
MM
At first glance, I’m interested because that 3600 rpm high gear sounds very appealing. I often work with small diameter twist drills and the faster the better, honestly. But the suggestion that one could use that gear range to drill with a 1 3/8″ Forstner bit? First off, that’s just plain dangerous for a handheld drill. Second, I highly highly doubt the drill has the power to turn a bit of that size at 3600 rpm under load, so that marketing suggestion sounds far out of whack. And no clutch? Strange.
I like the high speed but I’m not jumping into Festool just to buy this.
And speaking of high speed drills, I’ve been wondering if it might be easy to make one by modifying an existing drill. Most cordless drills have a series of planetary gear stages in them. Even in their highest gear I’m betting there is still one stage of reduction taking place in the gearbox. Take that out and the drill should now be faster in every gear (and, of course, lower torque). I’m highly tempted to do that, and have a dedicated low-torque high speed drill.
fred
In out fabrication business I think that some of the pistol-grip pneumatics ran at 4000 or more (no-load rpms) and the straight end drills could hit 20,000 or more. But a true 3600 rpm cordless might have been worth a try for refit work where an air hose was a nuisance. But Festool is unlikely to make a chuck to accept 1/4-28 threaded drill bits
Drew M
I’ve been asking for a M12 “aircraft drill” drill for a while now. I’d love to have a cordless drill that could do 4000+ RPM.
Collin
I’m pretty sure the Flex hits 4000 rpm in turbo mode
MM
From what I’m seeing on their website it’s 2500 rpm max in turbo mode. Flex’s drills only have two gear ranges so that’s really hurting them here.
Eric
Most of the brushless power tool motors seem to run in the 20k rpm range. So it should be easy enough to hit 4000k rpm, it’s just a matter of how much torque they would still have at those kinds of speeds.
MM
That’s precisely what I was thinking. Of course if the gear reduction is changed, by modification or by design, then the torque will go down by the same %. Double the speed and you end up with half the torque, for example. But I still think it could be useful, the kinds of things I would want the high speed for do not require high torque. Such a tool wouldn’t make much sense as a general-purpose drill where you might be using that low gear a lot but I think it would be useful as a special special purpose tool that’s optimized for drilling with small bits, the same way that many air drills are.
Now that I’ve thought about it some more, something I’d love to see a major tool company come out with: Take a standard full-size professional drill like a DCD996 for example and add a 1:2 overdrive shift lever to it. You’ve got the normal 3 speed ranges, and then a separate lever that doubles the speed of whatever range you happen to be in–the same general idea of a doubler box, auxiliary trans, or 2-speed rear end used in heavy trucks or off-road vehicles. Doing heavy drilling like a big self-feed bit? First gear low range. Need to drill a bunch of small holes in sheet metal? Third gear high range. It’s easy to understand, easy to implement, would make the drill more useful without compromising its current performance, and would provide a unique marketing angle with the whole “overdrive” concept.
Drew M
exactly. “small” bits in aluminum.
rob
3,600 is less RPM than the previous Festool (PDC) .
Metabo, Fein and Festool all have had drill models that do over 3,500 in high gear (discounting readily available screwgun that to 5k). Metabo is the only one that I found to be useable at top speed. Fein was nearly useless and Festool was completely useless. There’s pretty much zero torque.
Mark
Rob , Dewalt has a cordless drill that reaches about 3500.
I found the old PDC ‘s 3800rpm very useful with drills smaller then 4mm in wood or steel for that matter.
Plus you can use a angle head or eccentric chuck which alone might make the drill worth it.
Adam
I think festool drills are over priced, I like some of the extra’s you get with festool drills like the right angle chuck and their very ergonomic , but you can buy cheaper drills that have more power,
Dave
Don’t forget that ink jet printer that comes with it…
Tim
Festool, Mafell, Fein and other high end companies often rate their tools at nomimal or actual performance instead of “theoretical maximum super peak (times 50) quantum astronomical units” of torque like “American” brands.
If your drill actually had 100ft lbs of torque it could fling you like a rag doll any time it wanted to. Don’t believe me? Go jack up a Honda and try to hold the wheel to a stop.
I have a Fein drill that is the most uselessly over powered unit on the planet and rated at like 550 in/lb of torque.
All that being said it’s probably a really nice drill if you’re into the Festool line which is expanding to be more useful.
Robert
Tim, the inclusion of the auxiliary handle would suggest Festool, at least, feels the real world torque output is what you describe.
Stuart
That is not a fair assumption.
https://toolguyd.com/drill-handle-torque-guidelines/
Whether an auxiliary handle is required or not comes down to UL guidelines and math.
Back in 2014, based on then-accurate and likely still-accurate guidelines, a cordless drill with a 6-inch handle length (from drill chuck centerline to bottom of the handle base) should not exceed 400 in-lbs unless it’s shipped with an auxiliary handle.
For shorter-handled drills, the max torque allowed without an accompanied aux handle will be even less.
Meaning, it doesn’t take a lot for an 18V cordless drill to require an aux handle.
XRH07
the Festool line’s going to need to expand a lot faster to be viable to anyone who doesn’t do exclusively finish carpentry. It’s fair to assume most people bleed into other areas and when Festool can’t even offer cordless basics like reciprocating saws or a normal circular saw in 2022 then their platform is largely a dead end. And an outright bad investment once you find yourself buying batteries, chargers and tools from a more comprehensive brand.
RI Guy
Festool. I only use their sanders and extractors. Everything else not worth the premium
Adrian Borsje
True, I started with hilti cordless years ago, awesome great but limited range. So now I run Makita as well. The two brands combined covers everything my building business needs.
Mark
That’s a fair statement. However you can spend your money on the sanders though .
I have their circular saw .Seems normal to me , even as a opyional rail attached , makes things quick and easy.
Stuart
Torque is very standardized these days, and all brands *should* be testing them on torque gauges with hard and soft joint adapters.
Festool is also a Power Tool Institute, with the organization having published lab test procedures for taking such measurements.
https://www.powertoolinstitute.com/pti-pages/mb-member-brand-profiles.asp
https://www.powertoolinstitute.com/pti-includes/pdfs/TorqueLTP.pdf
In other words, Festool’s 442.5 in-lbs max torque claims should compare accurately against other brands’ max torque claims.
According to conventional speed and torque relationships, and the conservation of power, increasing the speed will involve a decrease in max torque capabilities.
Festool doesn’t disclose the max speed of its lower speed range, and I also couldn’t find max torque specs for their higher speed ranges.
442 in-lbs of torque can certainly do a lot, but I would have expected more from Festool’s “best drill ever.”
Rob
The max hard torque claim on the Festool USA website is 663.8 in-lb (which is a muuuuuch more accurate translation of 75nm than other manufacturers). I would just call it 700 inch lbs. You are quoting the soft torque of 442.5 in-lb. It’s literally right there in plain English.
https://www.festoolusa.com/products/drilling-and-screwdriving/cordless-percussion-drills/576777—tpc-184-i-basic-us#TechnicalData
Are these specs still a joke? Yes. They were a joke a year ago.
Stuart
Thanks! Hmm, while considerably better, it’s still not “unrivaled.”
It’s still competitively underwhelming. The Dewalt DCD996, a 3-speed drill which came out 6 years ago, delivers 66/95 Nm (840 in-lbs) max torque.
The question is, how slow does it operate to reach those values, and how much power can it deliver at higher speeds?
It takes a high max torque rating for a cordless drill to be able to turn spade, auger, and self-feedings drill bits at higher speed settings.
rob
It’s an embarrassing torque rating for the size of the drill. They don’t make their own motors (afaik) and it shows. Compare the size of the motors in their drills to any other competitor and it’s just insane. There’s a lot under the hood (only the gearbox switch is mechanical) but the brass tacks are unimpressive.
With a four speed, you’re going to end up in 1st gear for just about everything and it’s very slow. I remember people on FOG telling me that their imported PDC could tear off your limbs. And then I owned one for myself and all it did was cut off and beep at me after being over torqued.
The core US Festool fan base seems to be a lot of retirees that got into woodworking and jumped over the professional brands and straight to the fancy stuff from low quality budget stuff they had been using their whole life. When the tid 18 recently came out, and I wrote a scathing review, I could tell that people on the fog praising the thing had never used an impact driver previously.
It’s a darn shame about the power specs because, otherwise, Festool makes the best drills. But, they’re kind of only good for small diameter wood drilling and cabinet screws. Torque wise, the T18/C18 sits in the same category as the Makita subcompact drills. I will generally grab the little Makita’s before my T18 because of it. And size wise, I believe the XGT and Milwaukee drills I have are shorter than the Festool with a chuck on it.
I’ve owned just about every Festool tool. And I loved Festool drills. But, they’re a sander and router kind of company. They don’t compete with Hilti, Dewalt, Milwaukee and Makita. I see a lot building company youtube shills getting into Festool after they partnered up to market the impact driver. These guys are blown away by the precision, the quietness and the small details, but they’re going to figure out really quick that Festool isn’t gonna perform in their environment. It’s not supposed to (despite their current marketing lingo).
That said, you and I both know that Festool gets way too much undeserved naysaying. Most of their products are truly great. And then there’s oddballs like the Carvex that simultaneously is the most overrated and most overbashed tool to exist.
Jared
That is a little better, but not exactly impressive. This drill still only makes sense to me if you need high speeds – and I would much rather have better torque.
Julian Tracy
I own a lot of Festool tools, and have always felt some were worth the premium: sanders, domino, vacuums, tracksaw (no real competition years ago…) and some were simply too overpriced compared to other very good quality brands: drills, routers, mitersaw, etc.
And frankly, their cordless lineups, aside from being stupid $$$, have also been woefully lacking of the variety of handy tools other name brands have produced which further to justify the expense into the ecosystem.
I will say though, that my old C12 Festool drill had simply the most precise and responsive speed control of any cordless drill I’ve used since. You may not think a precise speed “ramp up” is that important, and perhaps its not really, but it was very noticeable compared the chunky speed changes of the variable speed switches in my Makita and Milwaukee drills and drivers.
Even my brand new Milwaukee M12 FUEL bandsaw, a fairly premium tool within it’s system, has a very inconsistent and sloppy variable speed trigger response.
Mike
I’ve never been impressed by their drill offerings. Track saw was amazing and still might be the best but has a lot of close competition on its heels. Same with their sanders. That way my first Festool and it’s great, but a lot of competition in that market too now. I’d rather them just focus on the high-end woodworking stuff. Leave the drills and things to everyone else.
Ade
There’s a dial wheel set into the rear base of the handle to control the clutch settings.
Stuart
Thanks!
I haven’t seen it any of the product images I’ve come across. It’s also not mentioned in any product marketing copy. I’ve seen torque dials placed at the rear of the gearbox, but not for this one. Having it placed close to the battery would explain this.
Rog
Stuart, this is one of the things I appreciate about this site; you’re not afraid to call out products and brands. Most people would fawn over this simply because of the name attached to it.
Stuart
Thank you, I appreciate it!
I’m always a little worried that brands and readers alike might not understand my motivation for posts like this. I’m not critical or negative without reason, I do it for transparency.
With this drill, there could be something I’m not seeing, and I’m hoping to hear from dissenting opinions.
As a Festool owner, I’m a bit disappointed at their latest updates and new releases. Someone showed a demo of the new router on social media, and it was spraying chips all over the place, even with a Festool dust vacuum attached and running. What’s the point of a compact Festool router that has lousy dust collection?
With this hammer drill, while it could be a perfectly respectable mid-level performer, its emphasized “best drill ever” marketing seems like uncharacteristic hyperbole.
Not all Festool tools are *for me*, but I can usually still see what problems they solve and what types of users they might be aimed for.
So who is this aimed at? If I were a finish installer, I’d want something smaller and lighter. If I were a rough work tradesman, I’d want something more powerful.
Festool USA are great people, but that’s also a problem; I don’t want people to make me feel better about the tool, I want the tool to speak for itself. (That’s why I didn’t ask further questions in the absence of PR details of context.) I waited a month, and nothing I’ve seen has softened my early opinion, and so it was time to share.
There’s always a chance I’ll feel better about a tool after more info is sent my way, after a discussion with a product manager, or after a demo, but any of that might quickly paint over my early opinions and impressions.
Should that happen, isn’t it important for me to share those early impressions while they’re still fresh? There’s also a chance this is always how I’ll feel about this tool.
Festool is also a trickier brand than most, as you have two major groups of opinions – “everything Festool makes is awesome,” and “everything Festool makes is overpriced.”
With this drill, I can see where a 4-gear range could come in handy, and I like the idea of anti-kickback sensors, but the sum of all the features and specs doesn’t add up for me. The question “who’s it for, and why?” has been eating at me a bit.
ken
Tim – I think you are confusing inch lbs and foot lbs the drills might have 500 inch pounds but not 500 foot lbs. The Honda has 100 foot lbs. Obviously the Honda engine has more power than a typical cordless drill by many times. I do appreciate your comment though as perhaps it is rated differently than the other brands. I am not sure how standardized these tests are accross brands. Anyone know how these companies measure inch lbs?
Stuart
As mentioned in my comment above – https://toolguyd.com/festool-quadrive-tpc-hammer-drill-576778/#comment-1435435 , Festool is a PTI member, and there’s no reason they would test drills for max torque in any way other than the guidelines put forth by the industry group.
JoeM
I see Festool is to Tools, what Dyson is to Vacuums, Fans, and those Hand Dryers in public restrooms these days. Overestimated. Status objects at best.
Did they come up with something that proves “New Tech” isn’t always “Valuable Tech” with this release? Yeah. But then, I look at the prices of everything else they make and… well, it’s the same thing.
I think Festool is a set of good tools. But not premium-to-rare price level tools. And no matter the shape, size, or features of the Systainer boxes, they’re not worth the premium numbers they’re asking for them at retail, or wholesale. There are expensive brands out there, I know, some even complain that DeWALT and Milwaukee are starting to ask too much for Their tools and batteries as well. I don’t agree with those statements, but I do hear it as an argument people make for Festool’s prices. I happen to think DeWALT and Milwaukee are just at the border between “Butter Zone” and “Not At That Price” where Festool is consistently at “Too Expensive For That Product.”
So… All that considered, the fact that their brand over-confidence has surpassed their usability and value? Doesn’t surprise me. That gear shift also looks incredibly irrational to me. If that gear box is depending on the user to stop every time and look where the third gear is, it’s not exactly efficient. If anything, the numbers should go clockwise, or counter-clockwise, to allow for faster stepping up, and down, of the gears as needed. I know Cars don’t always do that with the stick-shift, but this isn’t a car, it’s a Drill. Sometimes a hole you’re drilling doesn’t particularly behave, and you need to be able to quickly stop, change gears up or down, and find the sweet-spot in what you’re drilling. Sometimes that’s due to density changes, sometimes that’s due to being given the wrong information about the material you’re drilling through… either way… That gearing system is not inspiring a lot of confidence with me. Admittedly, I do enter into this, seeing Festool and knowing it’s overpriced. I’m trying to be objective, but I can’t deny how much the tool seems to confirm my bias.
fred
The brand does have its fan base. Tom Silva on TOH is often seen using their products – but more often you spot other brands in use on TOH. I’m happy with my Domino XL machine – but less so with my TS55. But both were acquired when the represented something new and different. I don’t regret having purchased either – but see no reason to purchase any of their drills or most of their other tools, If I were doing lots of on-site edge banding – then maybe their Conturo would be worth a look. Festool seems to me to be a bit like some other European brands that may have found their niche – but don’t have the resources or inclination to expand the breadth and scope of their offerings to match folks like TTI, SBD or Makita. At least they don’t seem to be retrenching like Lamello seems to be.
rob
Bro, we Festool, Lamello, Mafell, and Fein homies exclusively use SEBO and would never be caught dead with a Dyson product.
JoeM
Umm… Rob? I didn’t say anything about Festool owners and Dyson… It’s an Equivalency… Between Festool and Dyson in their equivalent industries…
Dyson is overpriced because they invented a special cyclone system that controls air pressure very precisely. Thinking it was the only thing that matters, they produced model after model, charging way too much for the premium of being associated with Dyson.
Festool is, as far as I can tell, running the same scheme. It’s not that they are consistently producing 10-star-out-of-5 products, it’s that they’re producing what was innovative 20 years ago (like Dyson did) over and over again, with a price tag that matches the once-innovative pricetag of when they started. They are now no longer as innovative as they were, in fact, they stopped being that innovative within 5 years of starting up. Yet, here we are, still expecting Festool’s name to be enough. I literally, and figuratively, don’t buy it.
As to the other brands you mention… I’m not particularly impressed by them either. European brands, to be sure, but the prices are not really justified. Fein, unlike the rest, has at least continued their innovation in one form or another. Though known for a specific product, they’ve extensively expanded that line, and its many necessities and consumables. Even going as far as reinventing it all together. The rest of the brands, and Festool, are still basing their entire high pricing scheme on those initial “legendary” tools that they were famous for.
Rob
I was being jovial with my SEBO comment. That said, I thoroughly agree with your comparison. In most ways, they’re resting on their laurels.
Their truly recent innovations were the more flexible but durable hoses and an on/off remote paired to a Bluetooth module on their vacs. That’s about it. That said, nobody else came after the hoses and just finally Hilti came after the on/off remote.
There’s the rub. If nobody is coming after your innovations…why innovate further?
Can you buy another router that has a simple plastic chip deflector for edge work? Do other routers even come with dust extraction in the US?
Go down the Festool offerings and you’ll see a lot of that kind of thing. They’re stagnant wherever and whenever nobody comes after them.
JoeM
Sorry Rob, I couldn’t tell. Please don’t be offended. I had to check though. Glad we’re kinda on the same page there, but… I just didn’t know if I had offended you or not.
Honestly, Festool is a tool company, like any other. My problem is always more of an issue with their fanbase giving them way more patronage, and attention, than is proportional to what they make.
And the Systainer system? Oy… Those fanboys need to get a room already… It’s a box… and they’re paying 10x what it’s worth, quite proudly I might add, for a name on a box.
I’ll probably get called out on my love of DeWALT TSTAK after that statement, but it’s not the name I like, it’s the form factor. And I still hesitate to buy them at their price range. I would like these kinds of nickel-and-dime schemes to be ironed out in the tool industry, sure, but I know I’m totally outvoted there, by all those who are still Festool/Systainer obsessive. fred (the great and venerable) mentioned their Domino XL… Okay, great… They have one or two legendary tools that don’t really have equals in the construction level North American market… So… Where’s the Domino V2.0 XL? Or, something… a revision… an upgrade… yeah, I’d even be happier with their progress if they did something as simple as Bluetooth integration with their tools, with an app to do… something… anything… with their tools. But they really haven’t. They’ve used Bluetooth for other things, as you mentioned Rob, but why in the world is their fanbase so… rabid? I just don’t see it. Maybe I lack a soul or something? I dunno. I respect that these tool companies “Perfected” a tool worth respecting. I’m cool with that. At least it’s a good product. I’m not okay with the fan service they receive, 20 years since that product was released, without any revisions or complimentary lineups to go with it.
rob
Festool is just taking the gear change mechanism from the Fein drill that otherwise copied the Protool PDC quad drive drill that became the previous Festool PDC quad drive drill. You don’t need to look at the mechanism. It’s fairly obvious where you are. Festool, more or less, has made a four speed drill for close to twenty years. So, I can tell you without bias….these kinds of drills are crap anyway. Unless you want to be going 400 rpm max to get any torque out of it. A 2 gear drill is infinitely better.
Mark L Shelton
I own a lot of Festool…a lot. I make cabinets and do trim work for a living. I have multiple of some things like track saws and sanders. I have never used a better sander than festool sanders. I love the track saws.
Having said that I do not own a single festool drill. At the Festool price point the tool has to offer something that the other brands don’t. I have never seen anything their drills do that any others don’t. I use DeWalt drills and drivers. I prefer Milwaukee, but bought into DeWalt before finding this out. I also like that DeWalt is available almost everywhere.
surfjungle
Delighted to see this article and came to the same frustrating conclusions too Stuart. I like Festool for some things like saws, sanders and their multitool which I have first hand experience with. When this was announced some months ago, I thought it might be good to reuse some of my batteries. After reviewing the spec, I just couldn’t believe the lack of Torque at 75NM. All the usual suspects have been up to 120NM for years now. If I were to get a shit kicker on the torque side, it would be Makita or Hilti. This is a nice drill but most other top tier drills would wipe the floor with it and for a lower cost. There is either a solid disconnect between product management and marketing at Festool or they’ve made a very serious and very obvious market blunder. They also seem to be a little bit too caught up in technobabble. As far as I can see, they’re not doing anything special nor game changing. This is a very nice mid level drill as you said. Thanks again for the post and sharing your comments.
Stuart
The marketing technobabble really bothered me, but I tried to ignore all that for the sake of a more objective and focused post.
Festool USA says: “The TPC is extremely durable and, thanks to its brushless EC-TEC motor, has extreme resilience and endurance.” Just like every other brushless drill?
“The large number of attachments, combined with perfectly matched accessories, make the QUADRIVE an unrivalled hammer drill for a wide range of possible uses.”
Unrivalled hammer drill?!
“Maximum performance: Thanks to the extremely powerful, brushless, and therefore long-lasting, EC-TEC motor”
This seems more fitting for Greenworks than Festool. (https://toolguyd.com/greenworks-24v-cordless-tools/)
“Flexible cordless system: For applications with high power needs, the 4.0 Ah Li-HighPower Compact battery pack provides the ideal powerful, compact and lightweight solution The 5.2 Ah battery pack is the right choice for even more power for particularly difficult drilling and screwdriving applications”
The drill is only bundled with 4.0Ah batteries. Are they suggesting that it can deliver more power with a 5.2Ah battery? Then why, at $549 for the kit, does it only come with 4Ah batteries?
“The robust four-speed metal gearbox stands out in the QUADRIVE with its enormous power and high speeds; it can handle even the toughest tasks.”
How is it going to handle “the toughest tasks” when it’s rated at low mid-level torque for modern non-subcompact hammer drills?
I’m also still waiting for Festool to explain their “2X faster” and “concentrated torque” track saw claims.
Frankly, I’ve been shocked and disappointed at how many unclarified claims Festool has been making about their latest tool releases.
I bought pricey equipment last year and was disappointed to receive old-style (not even T-Loc!) Systainers and older date codes. (If they had older equipment at US warehouses, why did I have to wait months for my order?!) These are entitled tool user types of complaints. But the barrage of “2X faster,” “concentrated torque,” “unrivaled our best drill ever” types of claims disappoint me in a very different way. Luckily, this is nothing like the “let’s call our tools FREAK and HITMAN” direction that Bosch went in.
Jim Felt
Maybe Bosch USA and the NA Festool distributor share a marketing company? A really tool knowledge deficient one at that?
But honestly that’s a whole bunch of Target tool level descriptive near fantasy.
Stuart
They do not.
rob
They get their “up to 2x cutting power” on the new saw because they’re finally selling thinner kerf blades with it. As one of the few fair and unbiased Mafell plunge saw owners, I always pointed out that the MT55 was cheating with it’s thinner blades.
surfjungle
Thanks Stuart for your comprehensive response. A few further points.
“Unrivalled hammer drill?!” – How do they qualify this if at all. Unrivalled in terms of quality accessories or just in general. The first is untrue, the second is chuckle-vision-tastic.
“The drill is only bundled with 4.0Ah batteries.” – It is risible to think that the marketing claims are being made with what I believe to be fairly standard batteries.
“The robust four-speed metal gearbox stands out in the QUADRIVE with its enormous power and high speeds; it can handle even the toughest tasks.” – like every other prosumer drill. I have a FEIN brushless 12v APS-C – its’ great for small stuff. It’s 4 speed. The gearbox is metal. What tough tasks can I expect to use it for given it’s 12v and torques out at 40NM? Also, think about that for a minute – it similar to the Festool but is just 35NM less – that’s pretty funny.
“These are entitled tool user types of complaints.” – No they are not because of the amount of money you are paying. If you pay money and make reasonable points, you get to complaint. The customer is always right.
Overall, this appears to be an exercise in mediocrity marketed as next gen. I cannot help but wonder if the original drills that these replace were actually better products. Perhaps that’s the clue? The originals were not 120NM on the torque front either – perhaps they replaced like for like yet are trying to market as something they are not. I’m looking forward to it coming last in key areas in various YouTube tests.
Ryan
So is this a hammer drill or drill/driver? I don’t see a way to disengage the hammer, so I’ll assume this is a multi speed drill driver and is being incorrectly called a hammer drill in the beginning of the post. I can’t imagine that transversely hammering a right angle attachment is a good thing.
Bosch offers a far more useful tool for half the price with an additional offset drive attachment. They further have an add on SDS attachment for the same tool making the Bosch a true hammer.
I look at Festool for precision and price that affords that precision. This hand drill won’t provide any more precision in the work piece, so the value isn’t there. No work enhancement, lower utility than competition, and high price make it a pass.
Stuart
Hammer Drill, although there looks to be a non-hammer drill/driver available in Europe. I pulled this from Festool USA’s social media, where they explicitly describe it as the TPC (hammer drill). The switch is supposed to be at the top front of the drill.
I’m sorry – it looks like Festool USA mixed up the images, and I didn’t catch it until you said something.
Jim Felt
So Festool has an intern loading their social media posts?
That’s sure nice of them. But only for that intern.
Stuart
Most brands’ social media teams would make the same exact mistake – or worse.
Addison
I just had to check out the specks on this, so I thought there was a good comparison in the M12 2505-22. The M18 will give you a sore wrist if you don’t watch out, so I thought give them a chance. Low power drivers that go all day should be light, not light duty.
If you are a tool company and don’t want to put out a line of tools like Milwaukee, Dewalt, or even Makita, the you may be a curiosity tool company, like Festool. The; but we have a nice box, our technology is antique, lazy German ‘engineering’, stranded without a battery next year, hipster ego trash nonsense. Pick your heads up, get out of the Woodcraft store, and start doing things, not talking about how your box attaches to your buddies box.
Jerry
Had a quadrive years ago, only thing I liked about it was the insanely fast 4th speed. Other then that I dumped it on EBay two months later. I’m sure the problem was I was expecting the monster quadrive made by Protool who Festool bought. But festool got ahold of it and screwed it up. One item is festools electronic clutch is crap. Bosch made an electronic clutch back in the 80’s that actually worked, I think the drill was model B2300. Then there was a problem with the battery voltage, drill only worked until the battery went down half way, after that it would malfunction.
Drew M
I’ll just leave this here… :^D
https://www.milwaukeetool.eu/en-eu/m12-fuel-sub-compact-percussion-drill-with-removable-chuck/m12-fpdx/
Stuart
The Milwaukee FDPX hammer drill has been out in Europe for 4 years now. https://toolguyd.com/milwaukee-m12-fuel-multi-head-drill/ =)
Drew M
… and 44nm of torque is right about 400in*lb.
rob
Dude, I agree with you that the Festool is weak and underwhelming but where are you getting your info from? It’s been out for a year across the pond. The torque is around 750 inch lbs. It’s the t-18 that does 450 inch lbs. The dial for the electronic clutch has been moved to the bottom of the handle (same location as the C18). The gear change mechanism is copied from a Fein model that is almost a decade old now.
Stuart
Festool USA:
rob
Ahhhh, I see that they played themselves.
Kevin
I’ve always been super divided on Festool, and I’m a spare no expense kind of buyer when it comes to tools tools that I like the best. I’ve come to the conclusion that Festool is a very niche brand. Not in a demographic sense, but more a tool by tool sense. Their tools that excel in my opinion are the ones that offer accessories that are uniquely proprietary and actually become useful (their barrel grip jig saws come to mind). Other than some unique peripherals that just aren’t available for other brands, I’m just a tad underwhelmed by their products. The fit and finish is great, but the build quality is definitely less than the big three brands; they also tend to be a bit underpowered as well. Their precision is definitely good, but not head and shoulders above anything else out there. In my experience you can be just as precise with the equivalent Milwaukee, DeWalt, etc. but I’d say with Festool things are a little faster to line up. I like the Barrel grip jig saw and the track saw, and possibly the Kapex, but everything else – I could take it or leave it. The oscillating tool is great but I can’t give them credit for that as it’s just a Fein in Festool clothing. Most of the time I’d probably just go with Milwaukee because they tend to have far more usable power and greater durability. I think the folks at Festool are aware that people aren’t tossing them around like other tools so build quality takes a back seat to some other aspects, which is my main issue with them. You’d think for the cost, you could have your cake and eat it too.
rob
Milwaukee M18 and (especially) M12, quite frankly, has the worst overall build quality I have ever observed in a power tool line. I don’t find my Mafell plunge saw particularly better built than the TS 55, and both are much better built than the other brands (regardless of the AVE parrots). I get why people “feel” like Festool isn’t built well, but that really isn’t the case. The carvex is pretty cheap on the business end. That’s all I can think of. They do send out more lemons than anybody else.
OhioHead
Please share more “details” about MKE build quality? I am confident any manufacturer can release a batch of tools that don’t meet quality build spec’s partially because of receiving “bad” pieces/parts from suppliers. The MKE warranty is generous to cover issues outlined by poster above.
I am fan of the MKE 12 ergonomics, nope, does MKE have a better “system” of 12v tools then Bosch, DW, Makita in the US, yup.
How could these ergonomic issues be fixed? Re-platform the batteries & use leverage better ergonomics…….the problem with this is upsetting dedicated users…..just like DW stuck w/ the 1 up 18v battery style to long vs. re-platforming to a slide style which is universal go to battery style.
Worked for DW 20 plus years ago, I own DW tools and firmly in the MKE 12v “system” without any warranty claims or build quality issues.
Julian Tracy
I have gathered up quite a few M12 system tools to complement my main Makita LXT and Dewalt 20V job site tools. Only complaint I have with the M12 stuff is the stupid difficult battery release. It’s at best objectively un-ergonomic, and at worst totally a paint in the butt and near impossible with some select tools.
Other than that, you have to hand it to MW for coming out with a wide breadth of specialty and oddball tools and doing so at very aggressive pricing.
fred
Hah, I thought it was just my fat fingers getting in the way of squeezing the ends of M12 batteries to get them off!
Kevin
Agree to disagree, it’s nothing but conjecture on both our ends and in my experience, I’ve have had the most success with Milwaukees build quality. They just stand up better over for me, and I’ve only ever had to claim warranty twice. I’m just not that impressed by Festool. Some of their tools have some nifty tricks but nothing groundbreaking imo. Everyone is going to have a different opinion based on their application/ use case. The biggest turn off for me is they’re always underpowered. For someone who need them for finish work, or only wood, I’m sure they don’t mind. For me, I‘lol pass on that detail alone.
John E
They got the nickname “Plastic Fantastic” for a reason.
Peter
I have a Fein 18V that has the same gear change setup and that is easy to get used to and no problem with gloves imho.
Late Night
Anyone used it? Feel good in your hand? Save the inferences from marketing hype until the thing has been in hand and used…
Stuart
“Inferences from marketing hype” are important.
As a tool user, I’d avoid this model, as I don’t see the appeal. As a reviewer, reader interest might prompt me to purchase or request an editorial test sample. In either case, my misgivings and hesitant opinions are valid and should be shared.
Preconceptions provide context.
Meanwhile, do you have anything to say about the tool, or is your only contribution to the discussion a judgement about me?
Late Night
Nothing personal and no judgement, specs while important are not everything.
Thus, what I have to say about the tool, since I nor you have used it, it is not helpful to pass judgement on a tool, without having used it for it’s intended application based on specs alone. So test it.
Cristobal Figueroa
I was just going to “let it go” but the amount of negative dog piling based on a post from somebody whose initial impression wasn’t even based on correct information is just silly. I also think it’s a bit rich to infer the ergonomics of a switch without ever handling it. I would be lying if I didn’t admit that I am not surprised though. As a long time reader of this tool blog, I miss the posts telling me about tools I was unfamiliar with based on actual experience doing and making stuff. Forming opinions from marketing material without seeking out the feedback from people who actually do things is like buying a car from what’s posted in the marketing material instead of driving it. It’s one of the reasons Ken Rockwell is reviled by so many in the photography world. The post equating Festool to Dyson reveals an ignorance of both vacuums and tools. Perhaps the time spent writing this article would have been better served picking up any of piled up tools and actually fixing or building something with it and posting about the experience. As far as the reactions in the comments, where to start? The brand tribalism? The weird amount of emotion whether pride, lust, or envy stemming from curated instagram shots of polished stacks of packout? It is just tedious at this point. If you don’t know what you are doing this festool drill isn’t going to fix that, but neither is the competitions drill. If you don’t do anything, I don’t think it matters much which color tools you collect. If you do have the skills and require decent tools to make a living or enjoy your hobby I am sure this drill will be sufficient for 99% of users, as will the competitions.
Stuart
There are some brands I spend a lot of time defending against naysayers, and Festool is definitely at the top of the list.
So when a product’s features, specs, and marketing approach all detract from that tool’s appeal, I prefer to say so.
I get yelled at and criticized whether I’m overly positive, overly negative, and even when I’m completely neutral.
Maybe I’ve gotten grumpy over the years, but I’ve grown critical about by the amount of shallow marketing and hype.
Here, instead of your finding positive things to say about the design or marketing, you’re just criticizing and judging my opinion. I’m sorry my opinions offended you.
Cristobal Figueroa
I fail to see how my post is yelling at anybody or about anything. I certainly was not offended by anything you wrote. Notice I didn’t even mention my opinions on any tools or tool brands. I certainly was not going to defend nor criticize a specific tool I have no experience with. My frustration just stemmed from reading a post that I do not believe is your best work, and seeing your speculative conclusion set off a cascade of pile-on negativity. It’s not because the brand in question was Festool, although it doesn’t surprise me that you state you spend a lot of time defending them due to the amount of flack they get due to the tools being expensive. The comment was simply the suggestion that posts and comments regarding tools one has never used, should perhaps keep that important caveat in mind. If nothing else, it may decrease on the number of confirmation-bias-disguised-as -feedback that are not only useless but tedious as well.
Regarding me finding something positive to say about the design or marketing….I think I covered my feelings on commenting on the design of tools I have not used (aside from maybe aesthetics which is the least important trait when discussing tools). As far as marketing goes, the entire reason that I spend time on sites like this is I place zero credence in tool marketing material. In fact almost without exception tool industry marketing is super cringey. Whether my impact driver is a freaks, or my choice of ratchet makes me a tool rebel no real bearing on whether I can complete a task. I also don’t really care to spend a bunch of time pointing out how ridiculous it is because it would be like repeated posts and comments on water is wet.
I have been a constant reader of this site since it’s inception so you can consider me a fan. I didn’t take offense at your post, but your belief that I did is perhaps a bit of projection. If that is the case the only thing I can say is that was not my intended goal.
Stuart
In general. I get a lot of emails and comments disagreeing with my expressing opinions no matter the connotation.
I didn’t intend for the dog-pile, and the segues into criticisms about Dyson vacuums and Festool Systainer tool boxes was also unexpected.
Festool has been tricky. I asked if there would be press info, and this is what I received after my roundup post was published: “a newly refreshed hammer drill” – one line buried within summarizing info. That’s the extent of what Festool wanted to share with media about the hammer drill.
Via public sources, I received several “Our Best Gets Better” emails, logic-defying claims of “2X faster” saws, and claims of the Quadrive being “unrivalled,” “extremely durable” with “extreme resilience and endurance” “thanks to its brushless motor.”
I waited a month to see if I’d find it more appealing, or if more context would be released, and I shared my unabashed views as a tool user, Festool owner, and occasional tool shopper.
I tried to be completely objective at first, a couple of times, but aside from the many holes in tech specs, I grew frustrated at the hype.
Who is this for? How is it better? Why should I buy this? Why should you buy this? If I cannot answer any of this, I might as well share my personal opinions.
I have Festool’s cordless impact driver on my “outgoing tools” pile. I’ve forced myself to use it occasionally since my review two years ago. https://toolguyd.com/festool-tid-18-brushless-impact-driver-early-review/
Two years later, it still has zero distinction. My assessment of it being a “satisfactory” tool remains unchanged. It’s completely unremarkable. I suppose that’s good for Festool loyalists.
Here, we now have an “unrivalled” updated hammer drill where Festool can only tell – but not show – everyone its benefits. Their claims counter conventional wisdom regarding low torque/high speed modes for operating larger diameter accessories. Is this also a merely satisfactory tool?
Part of the reason I share my opinions is because, more often than not, someone will chime in with insights that make me feel better about at tool. That hasn’t happened yet here about the Quadrive, but I’m still hopeful.
Jared
I endorse every part of this post. 😛
I was never at risk of buying a Festool drill in the first place, but what irked me was that I couldn’t figure out who WOULD want it.
It’s not a terrible drill – just expensive and weird.
I don’t often need my drill’s top speed for “drilling” activities, but if I accept someone might want a fast-spinning drill – do they also want one with comparatively mediocre torque that is expensive and kind of bulky?
I bet this will get positive press because it is a Festool drill and not everyone who picks up a drill is cognizant of what top-tier competitors have to offer – i.e. if you’ve been rocking a 5-year old Ryobi or an old 18v nicad Dewalt, I bet this would feel like a monster. It just doesn’t compare to the latest (and cheaper) offerings from Dewalt, Milwaukee or even Ridgid.
fred
My take is that Festool has often prided themselves on being ergonomic and doing things like dust control very well. One of the painting subcontractors we used a lot (and I employ for personal painting) uses their sanders and dust extractors – but seems to use M12 drills. He swears by the sander/vacuum combinations – and if I were in the market – I’d would likely try them out. Regarding their cordless tools, if their limited range of offerings covered my needs and I wasn’t already tied to a battery platform – then I might likewise try to put them in my hands to see how they feel. As I said before – Festool seems happy catering to their niche market – rather than trying to sell a plethora of different tools to compete with the likes of Milwaukee or Dewalt.
Stuart
Regarding Festool sander + extractor combinations, I agree with your painter. I own a CT26 and an ETS150. They’re fantastic on their own, and they make an even better combination. I also use Festool abrasives, and I never have to think about any of it, it just works and at a level of what I consider to be unbeatable performance and convenience. That’s what makes the shallow hype they’re throwing behind some of their recent tools so disappointing – they’re better than this.
Perry
I used to think of Festool like a high end chisel. Not the hardest steel possible, not so soft that the edge wore quickly, but just the right hardness along with ergonomics that made it a pleasure to use. They fit the hand well, they were quiet and light, and the torque and speed controls were far beyond what most big brands offered.
That has really changed over the years as other brands have caught up and festool has not done much to innovate within that niche. Offset drivers for cabinet makers? Bosch, Milwaukee, and a few others make them now as well. Better gradation of power through the switch controls? Makita and hitachi are great at mid level and other big brands at higher price levels, along with the ability to tune the torque curve through wireless apps. Track saws? Many options now that are arguably better. Tool storage? So many options.
I used to really love my old festool cordless drills when I was in cabinet shops, but these days I’d stick with my last gen hitachi 12v over most of what festool offers.
TK
I actually bought the TPC last week. I already knew its limitations in the power department. It will surely be destroyed in all of the youtube vs. reviews. I recently sold my M18 Gen 3 2804 drill because I hated it so much – especially the screechy sound it made. The TPC is very refined, sounds fantastic, buttery smooth, and well balanced. Feels much better to use than the M18 ever did. The fastfix adapters are a great option to have when you need them. The E-clutch actually works for small fasteners unlike the Milwaukee. The anti-kickback is awesome protection when drilling large holes. Yeah – it could use some more power but it has plenty to get the job done. BTW I have a hard time believing this isn’t actually manufactured by Fein like the vecturo is. If not, Festool would have had to license that gear shift design. Oh, yeah the shifting is great. WAAAY better than a DeWalt 3 speed slider where you always miss speed 2.
surfjungle
Thanks for posting a review. It’s good to have something to balance the many concerns raised above for those that have not used this tool including myself . From what Festool I own, I am happy and it’s good to see that there is value to be gained for you when using this too. The cost is still a big challenge but hey, that’s Festool : )