What does the future cordless power tool battery landscape look like? Is it centered around pouch-format Li-ion batteries?
Milwaukee Tool recently announced their first M18 pouch battery, a 6Ah battery under their new Forge line of next-gen batteries.
Dewalt launched two sizes of 20V Max pouch cell PowerStack batteries – a compact 1.7Ah battery, and a 5Ah battery.
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Flex has 3 pouch cell 24V Max batteries – 3.5Ah, 6Ah, and 10Ah.
CAT – made by Positec – has a “Graphene” 5Ah battery.
Pouch cells definitely offer advantages over cylindrical cell Li-ion batteries, but do they represent the future of the cordless power tool industry?
Milwaukee’s next-generation MX Fuel batteries and upcoming M18 Forge 12Ah battery will be built using new tabless cylindrical Li-ion cells, showing that that advancements are still possible with the older form factor.
A year ago, Milwaukee introduced new High Output M12 batteries.
In the case of the upcoming M18 Forge 12Ah battery, Milwaukee opted for tabless cylindrical cells over pouch cells for reasons related to performance and cooling or thermal endurance.
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Makita has yet to offer higher capacity or higher output batteries to their 18V line of cordless power tools. If their inability or unwillingness to introduce improved batteries over the years is tied to size and form factor constraints, they might be limited in what they could offer in the form of pouch cell batteries.
But what about moving to tabless batteries, where there might be minimal deviation from their existing battery pack shapes and sizes?
What about Bosch? Ryobi? Metabo HPT, Metabo, Kobalt, Ryobi, Festool?
Tool brands have introduced physically larger battery packs before, and so it might not be a big difference to do the same again with pouch cell batteries.
If cylindrical cell technology has a bit of runway left, it could potentially slow down pouch cell proliferation, especially if pouch cells are capacity-limited with respect to thermal endurance.
While there are only a couple of pouch cell cordless power tool batteries on the market or slated for release, all of them have capacities similar to existing 5- and 10-cell cylindrical batteries.
15-cell battery packs, such as Dewalt’s FlexVolt 9Ah and 12Ah batteries, and Milwaukee’s M18 12Ah battery, have grown popular over the years for high demand tasks and jobs where long runtime is a high priority.
Where are the equivalent pouch cell batteries?
Milwaukee will soon market their Forge 6Ah battery, and later their Forge 12Ah battery, with the first engineered with pouch cells and the latter with tabless cylindrical cells. Once both batteries are released, it will mean Milwaukee will have 4 different types of cordless power tool batteries active at the same time – standard, High Output, Forge pouch, and Forge tabless.
Users have gotten used to seeing battery packs with 18650 cells sold alongside newer higher output batteries built with 21700 cells.
Instead of pouch cell batteries being the future of the cordless power tool industry as many have thought, will it simply be a part of things?
Where are Dewalt’s PowerStack 10Ah, 12Ah, or 15Ah pouch cell batteries? Why hasn’t Bosch made a peep about the future of their 18V cordless tech?
CAT, a newcomer to the USA tool market, has a pouch cell battery. Where’s Ryobi’s?
If there are reasons that tool brands cannot move towards pouch cells, whether because of performance, size, or cooling reasons, does that suggest that there’s room for pouch cell tech to grow?
Could there still be room for cylindrical cell advancement, such as tabless designs that deliver higher current – at the least?
Pouch cell batteries are definitely shaking things up in the cordless power tool industry, but it’s apparently not the only technology thrusting things forward.
How big of a role will pouch cells play over the next few years? At this time, it’s looking like they will be a major part of the cordless power tool industry, but will share the stage with other new technologies.
I think it’s going to be an interesting couple of years.
Big Adam
I’m slowly replacing my 4Ah and 5Ah Dewalt batteries with Powerstack units as they die. But I’ve had a couple of Flexvolt batteries fall over recently and I’m holding out for Dewalt to bring a pouch equivalent to market.
Not sure who will blink first!!
Stuart
What I’m wondering now is whether there will be a FlexVolt pouch battery and what its capacity might look like.
Milwaukee is going with improved cylindrical cells for their upgraded 12Ah battery. Will other brands eventually do the same?
The 18V (and comparable) battery landscape will soon have:
18650 and 21700 cylindrical cells in 1P (5 cells), 2P (10 cells), and 3P (15 cells) configurations, and even beyond that for some brands.
But also 1P pouch cell packs, and in Milwaukee’s case a 3P pack with tabless cells.
The new M12 High Output batteries also have improved 18650 cells.
The choice used to be “how much runtime do you want?”
Things got more complicated, and I thought pouch cells would simplify things.
It’s looking like pouch cells will eventually be the best option for compact and mid-size batteries, but perhaps not for the highest power or charge capacity tiers.
Big Richard
They could do a 15Ah/5Ah going 3P with the same cells in the current 5Ah PS. But they already have a 15Ah/5Ah, so I feel like if they do they would likey go bigger. 18Ah/6Ah, a 3P pack using 6000mAh cells? That’s a big if, though. It’d be cool, and cost $500.
Stuart
It’s hard to say – 15 pouch cells would be a lot, and it’s going to be difficult to keep everything cool.
mark
don’t makita do a 40v range, everyone is switching to that, no point buying much 18v stuff is there
MFC
You can use a charged flexvolt battery to jump a dead one. I’ve had four flexvolts that the charger refused to charge and after jumping them and leaving them on the charger they came back again. A couple had to have the process repeated months later but they’ve all been functioning for years like this. It seems that some tools can drain them a little too far and then when they balance, it pulls the overall voltage too low for the charger to recognize. As unsafe as it sounds I stick two scraper blades into the positive and negative terminals (they’re marked B- and B+) and then make sure I line them up battery to battery (don’t mix – and +). I hold them together for 20 seconds or so and make sure that it’s not heating up too much while power is transferring. Anyways, it’s worked on all of them for me so far, but it probably isn’t the safest so take precautions.
MM
I’ve had this issue happen with brand new 10ah 20V max batts. I left them plugged into my lawn mower for a while and apparently it drains power from the batteries even when not in use, something I haven’t experienced with any of the 20+ other Dewalt tools I have. It drained the batts to the point that my standard charger wouldn’t recognize either of them. One of them worked when I tried it on an older charger. The other I had to manually charge using a variable power supply on my test bench. I’d be wary of using big flexvolt battery to “jump” another one, the currents involved could be massive. A 12V trickle charger should do the job a lot safer, something where you can limit the current. If you were stuck using only other Dewalt batteries I’d try and use a small one, like a 2ah, to do the “jumping”. That limits how much energy will be dumped into the dead battery.
Ben
Wouldn’t a 12V trickle charger be too low-voltage to charge a 20V battery? If the battery discharges to say 14 – 15V, and the 12V charger puts out 12 – 13V, you’d just be adding more load to the battery if you’re trying to force current in there. Maybe if the battery discharged lower than the trickle charger’s voltage, you could get it up to where the battery charger would recognize it and take over?
MM
The trickle charger wouldn’t charge it fully but it will charge it enough that you can get your normal charger to recognize it and then take over. When I had the problem with my 20V 10ah packs I measured about 9V left on the pack which was not enough for the charger to detect. I used a constant-current DC power supply set to 500 mAh, over about 15 minutes it slowly crept up to 14v and then it worked fine on the Dewalt charger. So at least for Dewalt 14 seems more than enough to work. It might work at lower voltages, I’m not sure. But I know that the boundary is somewhere between 9 and 14.
Jared
I’ve also jumped packs my charger wouldn’t recognize. 20 seconds seems like a long time though!
I’ve only ever had to do it for a couple seconds before checking the pack on the charger and having it work again. You’re only bumping up the voltage enough so it registers back in an acceptable range, not actually charging the battery.
I’m not saying you’re wrong – just adding my 2 cents in case someone reads this and tries for themselves. It’s probably safer to start small.
MFC
You’re right Jared, starting small is safer, but after having so many die I’ve found it’s better to just smack ’em back with longer times of connectivity. However, I was watching the temps with a thermal imager when I first began doing this and others might blow themselves up, so start small and work up to higher times if needed.
Big Richard
I think FLEX’s larger stacked battery is 10Ah, not 8Ah as the article states.
Stuart
Thank you – you’re right. Sorry, I was using SKU/size info provided by Flex and didn’t notice the error.
MM
I like the Dewalt Powerstacks a lot, especially the 1.7ah. It’s nice to have a lot of power delivery in such a small, lightweight, battery. While I’d really like to pick up some 5ah powerstacks I can’t really justify it right now. Currently I’m pretty well covered for larger size packs. I have a number of 4 & 5ah 20v and a few 9ah Flexvolts I’ve accumulated over the years, and last year I ended up adding 2 10ah’s and 2 15ah Flexvolts. But it’s only a matter of time that some of those 4ahs are going to fail, I can already tell some are getting weak with age and when they do I will be replacing them with the 5ah powerstacks.
I’m also curious where the pouch-style Flexvolt batteries are!
Rog
As a DIYer/homeowner, the Dewalt 1.7ah Powerstack is perfect for me. It pairs great with the 850 for anything I’ll ever do with them.
I’d love to get some new batteries for my Makita stuff but I can’t do it. They really need to update the LXT battery lineup. Would ANYTHING kill you, Makita??
Jay
Bosch recently did a video in German about batteries.
They admit that pouch cells does have some advantages but for the following reasons they will not make batteries with pouch cells:
1. Pouch cells expand and contract during use.
2. The cell itself is not as mechanically robust as cylindrical cells.
3. Pouch cells have no CID.
(CID is basically a safety valve which disables the cell if pressure gets too high, for example due to over charging).
Now, there are workarounds for all of the above mentioned, but all in all, Bosch feels like it is not worth it. In stead they are pursuing other new battery technologies. They do have specific technologies in mind at this point.
Steve
I really want to like Bosch, but they are so far behind. Hopefully their German engineer brains come up with something great.
I actually heard an ad for Bosch on the Joe Rogan podcast, which is pretty high level advertising…it looks like they’re trying hard to catch up!
PW
I heard a Bosch ad on a much smaller podcast very different from Rogan. A very curious marketing strategy. I’m used to the ads for mattresses and meal kits, it was almost jarring to hear a major name brand. I wonder what their thought process is.
Bosch seems to have a weird NA marketing approach. I remember people got really wound up a couple years ago when they started giving their tools names like “Hitman” and “Bulldog”.
Big Richard
My question about their future kinda depends on who is supplying these various pouch cells For cylindrical cells, all these brands can rely on the mass produced on-the-shelf cells from reputable giants like LG, Samsung, and Sanyo. Are these pouch cells all bespoke? Are Milwaukee and Flex using the same 6000 mAh cells in their 6Ah packs (assuming they are both 1P packs)?
Stuart
Milwaukee has not publicly disclosed their battery source. To my knowledge, they are not mass produced.
Stanley Black & Decker has an innovation partnership with a company called Amionx, which focuses on “SafeCore” Li-ion battery technology.
Amionx is a “spinout from American Lithium Energy (ALE), a company that “manufactures custom batteries for military applications.”
We don’t know if Amionx produces batteries for Dewalt PowerStack, but there is some relationship via the Stanley Ventures program.
Robert
I’ve been reading that “tabless” batteries are not exactly tabless, at least in some designs, including Tesla’s.
“The term “tabless” is actually a bit misleading, since the tabs are integrated into the foils rather than removed entirely.” The current collector foils. They use the terms integrated tabs and integrated tabbing because each foil gets a small integrated tab.
One discussion:
https://www.comsol.com/blogs/improving-tabbing-design-in-cylindrical-batteries/
I was trying to visualize how a battery could be tabless.
Dust
I did the same.
The main difference for anyone interested, is the path that electrons travel in the battery roll. Tabbed batteries conduct across the width on the internal roll. Where as tab less short across the top allowing for a shorter travel and less resistance.
Chuck
I doubt Ryobi will introduce pouch cells, no matter how much I want it to happen. I buy ryobi stuff because it is much cheaper than DeWalt, and does what I, as a DIYer, need. There isn’t much space for Ryobi to move up battery pricing before you run into non-pouch DeWalt territory.
For as much as I like the ubiquity of the ONE+ form factor, eventually they have to switch to the slide in style. I think it would give them much more flexibility in tool design.
Blocky
An adapter would be easy enough to maintain backwards compatibility ala dewalt. An adapter for forward compatibility would be hilarious.
Jared
Ryobi expanded into pro-level territory recently, primarily with their HP line. My theory was that the decision was in response to SBD’s plan to have Craftsman tools span homeowner to pro uses (e.g you may remember the chart Stuart posted). While SBD’s plan never really came to fruition, I suspect TTI thought they could do the same, only faster and better since Ryobi was already an established line.
However, why not keep the trajectory going with some pouch cells? Ryobi doesn’t have to stop selling “regular” batteries at homeowner and hobbyist-attracting prices. Having pouch cells would just allow users to “grow” with the battery system without having to switch brands.
Rman
What are “tabless” cylinder batteries?
If they are same format as 18650 batteries then what is the gain of “tabless” ?
Also how are the pouch batteries getting their odd ball AH ratings. Ex 8AH. Are there two 4AH one on top of the other.
Stuart
Tabless cells have a different structure that allows for shorter current delivery paths and lower heat.
I don’t believe pouch batteries are arranged in parallel, at least not externally. Meaning, an 8Ah battery pack would have 8Ah cells.
Eliot Truelove
As far as I understand it, which is by no means expert, is that tabless isn’t really that, it’s that integrated tabs throughout the cylindrical cell means that the battery cell dissipates the heat towards the bottom of the battery as opposed to it radiating out all sides and thus heating up the cells next to it creating a solid block of cells that are heating up. By directing the heat downward to the end cap you can integrate a fan into the battery housing to cool the entire battery cell from that one side. Arrange them in series or in parallel and build in active cooling on the one side means you can get higher runtime and more available power with better heat dissipation.
Again, I’m not terribly knowledgeable about it as I’ve only just recently researched it myself, but that’s how I understand it.
My first thought about this technology for a tool battery is that I’d worry about if the active cooling on one side of the battery fails somehow because of batteries and tools being dropped and the internal fans or other cooling cracking and failing and you have uneven heating to one side of the battery and it blowing out the end cap of the cell, exploding lithium out that side, and thus creating an incendiary claymore.
I don’t know if there is redundancies or whatnot built into the battery. Because Tesla patented tabless battery technology for the larger 4680 car batteries that aren’t subject to the same environmental stresses that tool batteries would have, they may be a safe technology within cars that have more robust active cooking of the cells, but may be a liability when jostled and banged around when thrown into the back of a van or truck or dropped off scaffolding.
MikeS
https://www.theteslaspace.com/latest-posts/new-tabless-battery-patents-get-better-visualizations
Its a misnomer. Existing/common practice has one tab at the end of the roll. The new improvement is to have basically continuous tabs. This has many advantages and makes big improvements to the functionality of the cells. Tabless is a big deal.
jamanjeval
tabless refers to how the connections are made to the anode and cathodes (- and +)
In a cylindrical battery, the anode and cathode are two faces of a long strip, somewhat like the paper store receipts are printed upon. This long strip is rolled up into a cylinder. (so the width of this strip is the length of the battery cell, while the diameter of the roll is the cells diameter) Thus the name, cylinder battery.
The +/- connections are traditionally made with “wires” (tabs) onto the front and back of that strip, about midway though its length. So, the furthest an electron would have to travel along this strip is half its length. A problem arises in high current applications. because the electrons have to travel that distance, there is resistance and that creates heat. The heat is detrimental to the battery.
Tabless batteries connect along the entire length one of the long edge of their respective sides of this long strip. Thus the furthest an electron has to travel is the width of the strip, not half the length of the strip.
tabless cells are more complicated to make, but have lower internal resistance and thus can deliver more current and not get as hot. Even if they’re not being used in high draw applications they have another advantage: they can charge faster because they wont get as hot and can therefore accept more current from the charger.
Mxx
Interesting, and thanks for the explanation!
Champs
Months ago, I was in here posting about technical limitations holding back larger capacity yellow batteries. There’s been a slow trickle since then, but I think that the Bosch explanation above is honest and accurate. Sustaining almost two kilowatts of power from chemicals inside a small plastic box without blowing up is an impressive feat.
The outlier is FLEX, which now more than ever raises some questions, starting with “is anybody using FLEX yet” because I would love to hear about how that 10ah battery is doing.
Philip John
Milwaukee high output tools and batteries are not exactly great performing . These new batteries may improve them. The Milwaukee m18 9 inch is a horrible performing tool. I suspect the 14 in chop off is even worse
Would love to see Milwaukee m18 9 inch grinder with the 6ah forge vs. Dewalt 60v 9 inch with a 3 or 4 ah battery. Might not be fair… but Milwaukee entered this ho segment of tools and equipment advertising m18 v can compete. With out forge it can’t in my book.
Matt
Personally I love the m18 9″ saw with the diamond blade. My biggest complaint is the runtime, but the new 6ah battery wouldn’t help with that.
Actually, it might. The saw draws too much and overheats even the 12.0 with continuous use, so the 6.0 Forge might have an advantage here.
Philip John
Yes. It’s the same will almost all HO tools on m18.
Exception is super Sawzall . 3/4 Impact gun. I like the 9 inch when it works on light duty applications . Dewalt 9 in is 2800 watts. Milwaukee 9 inch is 900 watts.
JMJR
I like the concept of pouch cells, and have experience with LiPo pouch cells for RC applications that have incredible discharge rates despite their small size.
However best bang for the buck for large capacity batteries is always going to be an established size of cylindrical cell over a custom sized pouch cell. The quantity of 18650 and 21700 cells that are produced each year is orders of magnitude greater than what a custom pouch would be, so they can be far less expensive.
For instance, a standard Dewalt 5Ah is about $130, and the Flexvolt 15 Ah is about $400, just over 3x the cost. If a Powerstack 5Ah is $230, that would put a Powerstack 15Ah at $1150!!!
Big Richard
That math does not add up. 3x $230 would be $690.
JMJR
You’re correct, seems I had 5 on the brain and multiplied $230 x 5. $700 for a single 15AH battery is still a ton of money
Big Richard
It still is a lot, no doubt. When/if pouch cells become more prevalent, you would expect the costs to come down some.
Ct451
It pouch cell are only the future if you follow Milwaukee’s dogma of 18v. If you need more current without having ridiculously sized batteries you need improvements in the packaging of your cells.
The main advantage of pouch cells is their weight. It is also their disadvantage. If you need to protect them to make them good for tools you might as well roll them up into cylinders.
18v if good for a lot of tools but increasing costs for marginal gains for some tools is bad strategy.
Franco Calcagni
Batteries are like many other industries, technology advances, in part, to how and when it is needed.
PC’s for businesses, there was a time that most companies were changing every 18 months, to keep up with the needs of users, software, and web usage. Somewhere in the early 2000’s, the CPU wars advanced CPU’s to the point where the average user can easily keep a PC or laptop 5+ years.
I find that battery tech is getting there, Of course having more power is better, but for the average user, most batteries can handle the needs of most tools for most users.
The PC analogy I used, there were always a minority of power users, like CAD and design creators, video editors and similar that still always needed bigger and better. With batteries it is the same, there are users that use hi usage tools for long periods, thus needing bigger and better batteries.
But like in most businesses, the average sales person, administrative worker and just the general everyday employee, PC’s are capable of handling just about anything and don’t need to replace with the latest and greatest as soon as it is available.
I think batteries are there or just about at this point. Those that NEED the extra power are fewer than those that can get by with current battery offerings.
Are pouch the future, I don’t know. I am also not well versed in battery tech, but I am pretty sure the tool MFR’s have their R&D running around the clock looking for the next major breakthrough.
Lithium was just that when it came out. Maybe what is the future might not even be Lithium based…I do not know.
Most likely, pouch is the future…till it isn’t. When will something supplant it? I am sure the MFR’s keep R&D hush-hush and just release their latest and greatest when they have it.
We will see how it plays out. or now, I just purchased a 2 pack of Dewalt Powerstack 1.7 this morning, not so much because I NEEDED them, but thought…why not.
Even with 2-3 helpers and working at just won thing (driving screw, or making cuts). Between extra batteries and chargers being pretty fast, keeping up is not an issue.
Be it pouch or other tech, we are at a great place in cordless tools, where just about anything that was corded, can be had as cordless and be effective.
Joe H
I doubt Ryobi will adopt pouch style batteries but I wouldn’t rule it out. I’m curious to see what they do over the years more than most other tool brands.
Charles
portable power tools seem like a bad fit for pouch cells. I’m an Apple technician and the failure modes and possible outcomes for li-ion “pouch cells” like what we’re discussing are not something I’d like to be carrying around. cylindrical cells have the huge advantage of a steel case to contain them. and those are inside of a hard plastic housing. pouch cells inside of a hard plastic housing can’t be anywhere near as robust.
Collin
This article seems to be taking Milwaukee’s claims regarding tablesa vs pouch cells at face value. Do pouch power tool batteries really have thermal issues in the field, or is this just something Milwaukee presented as a theoretical issue?
I’ll tell you what does have thermal issues in the field right now, and most people will agree with me: Milwaukee M18 batteries, especially the 12.0 when used in something like a chainsaw or power cutter. I can’t go on Reddit or Facebook any other tool forum without reading about dancing LEDs on thermally overloaded M18 batteries.
I’ll tell you what I haven’t heard have issues with overheating, and that’s any of the DeWalt or Flex pouch cell batteries, which have been out for 2 years now.
Anecdotes aside, I would be interested in actual thermal endurance testing.
Stuart
It’s not theoretical; tabless cylindrical cells proved to be more suitable for the next-gen Forge 12Ah battery than pouch.
I have not seen the research, but I trust the information and reasoning that was communicated to me.
They have no reason to lie and every reason to ensure I understand details and contexts as accurately and thoroughly as possible.
I wouldn’t say higher capacity pouch cells have thermal issues, but that – as I understand it – tabless cylindrical cell batteries were demonstrably better with respect to thermal endurance during extended use and recharging cycles.
Nate
I’m pretty happy with my Metabo HPT MV and Bosch 12v batteries. The pouch cells have some advantages, but in practice it hasn’t meant much to me. More important to me is affordability so that I can buy a few extra cells.
Franco Calcagni
Agreed, I think many are happy with today’s batteries, and care more about price (sales) and reliability. Squeezing out a bit more juice or reducing the size, is nice, but not as important as it used to be. (for most users)
Mike
I’ve had pouch batteries fail in every device I own over the years (phone, laptop, tablet, watch). They all ‘puff up’ prior to their demise. I’ve NEVER had a cylindrical cell puff up and fail.
My question is, considering the greater amount of heat and physical shock tools take (as opposed to consumer electronics), can the puffed up failing pouch cells potentially erupt and/or burn?
Stuart
I have spoken to Dewalt and Milwaukee engineers, and both brands use sensors to ensure safe operation.
Milwaukee’s new Forge 6Ah battery, for example, will not charge or discharge if its pouch cells are swollen beyond acceptable parameters.
Franco Calcagni
I could be wrong, but the Dewalt Powerstack have not had these issues. Either they use better tech, or your phone, laptop, tablet and watch, used inferior tech, or did not proper safeties installed…or in your case, they might have been the first of their kind and were still problematic at the time.
Stuart, or anyone else, please correct me if I am misinformed, but Dewalt’s Powerstack have not had any “notable” issues. (I am sure someone has had a dud out of the box and returned it, I am speaking in general terms)
Stuart
I haven’t heard of any pattern of performance, safety, or failure issues yet.
Tom
“When a pouch cell ages it can begin to expand or “puff” as it is sometimes called in the industry. This is often due to small interior shorts that occur over time as the battery ages, creating gas that puffs up the cell. Because pouch cells are entirely sealed, the gas has nowhere to escape and thus creates the puffy, pillow-like appearance. The expansion of the pouch cell results in a reduction in performance of the cell as the layers of the cell further delaminate. Some degree of gas buildup can be retained by the pouch structure, but when the gas buildup becomes too great, the pouch can rupture explosively. This is a rare yet well documented phenomenon. The rupture releases a large amount of flammable gas – not a great situation to be in.”
– from DIY Lithium Batteries How to Build Your Own Battery Packs Written by Micah Toll
I’ve seen more than one pouch battery puff up. In fact, my son’s laptop battery pooped up so much the computer was no longer able to lay flat.
Yes, the container can be made to protect the pouch but I wonder how well they will handle drops and the rough handling of a construction site?
JD
Pouch or cell…there both still heavy. Been using the DeWalts for awhile now. I prefer then”2.0” amp over the 5.0 because of the weight difference.
Frank D
When it comes to pouch batteries, I don’t know whether they are the future or should be the future.
What I do know is that I have reservations about it, from experience with laptops. My wife has had two laptop batteries go poof and expand forcibly inside the laptop after 5 or so years, damaging the casing and / or internals and keyboard. And I have had one super compact system do it, of course with the manufacturer out of business, etc.
I have yet to hear of these expansion issues with cylindrical cells.
Lyle
Not sure if anyone will see this since it’s been a few days, but looks like Amazon has a sale on these batteries.
DEWALT Powerstack 20V MAX Battery Starter Kit, Rechargeable, 5Ah, Lithium Ion (DCBP520C) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BPK11KXY
I haven’t seen a deal on the new 5Ah version before. I also see some sales on the 1.7Ah versions as well.